Lots of great input in this thread if nothing else it got some people to start posting a bit more, I see Wouters name mentioned a bit, to follow what happened you really need to read most of the junior sailing thread, in particular trying to get the F12 going, he delayed writing the box rules by a very long time when we had people waiting to build boats, then he claimed ownership of all things F12 globally, then when nobody agreed had hissy fit and left