Thanks carlm

Think your saying CAD systems are just a design tool .

Most understand intuitively design aspects ,-Hobie shaped surfboards then devoloped the H-14 then 16 ,then 18 etc ,
each improved with knowledge gained . The 16 not really a great racing design ,--a classic Tornado- it is not ,
It is a great simple durable popular non boarded beach cat .

The concepts most understand, and the basics of design , I,m just an amateur cat designer ,just a fun hobby ,-weak on the actual applied engineering and calcs and would seek out Bill or an equally skilled experienced designer for plan review and recommendations before starting a project. Often do this with residencial design consulting with soil engineering firms ,-structural engineers ,-civil engineering firms on survey and zoning issues and site elevation planning , topos and site development and planning , local ZBAs & Twp engineering firm ,-truss engineers ,-TJI joist systems ,--panelized homes and panels ,steel engineering data ,beam spans etc ,--environmental engineering ,-advantec fields etc --precast conc engineering firms etc etc .
Always listen and follow their direction.

Sorry about the hurried posts and numerous typos , hope they can be deciphered --

Interested in building a Formula 14 or 16 with my boys ,
the F-14s have very open rules -L 14.3 B unlimited W no min
sail ar. 300 total in any config.

Two choises are available , either an existing production 14 that inc -Mystere 4.3 http://www.cat-alist.com/headlines/mystere4_3.htm
nice looking 14 ft,cat w spin
a Hobie 14 w hooter -http://www.catsailor.com/bb_files/30231-Monster.JPG
Trac 14 -http://www.geocities.com/cctexan99/trac/photos/
N 450 http://www.sail4u.be/nacra_450.htm
and several other good 14 ft production boats , or the option of taking a number of great looking 15 ft boats and reducing L to 14.3 -- The problem with production boats is they all weigh from 240 to 300 Lbs ,-though 300 sq ft of sail on a 14 L will help offset that , --but a 14 ht type const , or fold up plywd home built will weigh as little as 107 Lb with same sail ar.
120 plus Lbs on a 14 L is a much greater percentage of total and much larger factor , so -the F-14 class will need two categories in the near future --An ht lightweight boat category ,-and a production boat category with min boat weight of 240 or so ,

For any thinking of home building a project check out Phill,s excellent web site ,-one of he most helpfull nicest people around .
http://www.geocities.com/Phillbrander/

Some nice 14 projects shown -

A main concern in designing a F-14 or modifying an existing plan to add a spin and added loads and sail forces from it are getting enough volume in a 14 ft L to support boat crew weight plus sail forces particularly downwind where there is only 6 or 7 ft of hull Length from the mast base to the bow. -Moments and pitching are a much greater concern than the 25 ft L C class hull with its main goal of reducing surface area . A scaled down C would {as Bill noted}- would not have enough volume , and would pitch and hobby horse terribley , and would pitchpole very easily -

Designing in more proportional volume ---
One experience I had with a very old design cat called a Pheonix with very wide buoyant hulls that I restored was its poor characteristics when it heeled or flew a hull.
It was very wide and deep in section just forward of the crossbeam with narrow bow and shallow stern . As it heeled up,- one hull skimming in typical mode,- the wide large volume mid area hull would , due to its wide center area and change of heeled underwater shape would pivot around its buoyant center sections and nose dive in a bow down attitude . Not a good design feature for any cat .

Actual sailing modes and heeling angles are important considerations , calc of sail forces , crew weight on the wire, righting moments , stability , how the design will respond under a wide variety of sailing conditions seas ,winspeeds ,crew weights , mast height sail area variations , balance CE clr -it is a wonderfull intricate engineering art form of sorts.

Canted hulls are an interesting aspect of cat design ,
They present a more complex interplay between heel angles and allignment of the two hulls under sailing conditions or in more bow down attitudes and hull submersion from sail forces with hull up or two in during mid and lighter wind conditions.

The F-14 design project hulls will need to be fuller ended , wider per scale with a larger hull beam to L ratio to provide sufficient volume. The unlimited beam is an interesting aspect , with proportional bow volume area required from the additional crew righting moment might lead to a very wide bow section design and an attempt at a planning type hull shape in that size range.
Planning sail design requires wide flat bow sections .
http://www.whbs.demon.co.uk/sr2/content_fr.htm

The other option of a F-14 sized production boat modified would be a fun project also , The Mystere uses a Dart like hull configuration with molded in fin skeg -keel ,this addes some volume as well and makes the balance under spin asier a does the N 450.

All types of sail plan configurations are possible on any F-14 , hope we see some interesting fun innovation.


Last edited by sail6000; 02/24/04 02:32 PM.