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Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: ] #133826
03/06/08 10:20 AM
03/06/08 10:20 AM
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Posts: 1,884
Detroit, MI
mbounds Offline
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No - they'll make a short list of equipment to be used at the mid-year meeting, then finalize it at the November meeting.

That allows 6 months of political maneuvering for the classes chosen / not chosen before the equipment is finalized in November.

-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: mbounds] #133827
03/06/08 10:39 AM
03/06/08 10:39 AM

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Anonymous
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Ok got it - thanks. I did read a little quickly.

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: ] #133828
03/06/08 10:43 AM
03/06/08 10:43 AM
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West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
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That would mean that any "unorthodox" classes like the Bladerider for singlehander and 29XX for women doublehander would have to be decided in November. Who is deciding, ISAF Council again, or someone more in touch?

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: rexdenton] #133829
03/06/08 10:46 AM
03/06/08 10:46 AM
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Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
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A legitimate request - some of ths has been confidential information as strategies were developed, but much of it is out in the open now.

Currently, as the March 15th deadline looms, several multihull platforms are being submitted as equipment for selection. The range of performance and cost is broad and meets any criteria that ISAF may finally settle upon. At the same time, multiple submissions from multiple MNAs have been authored for the mid-year meeting that directly challenge the matter of "urgency," require the application of rules associated with appealing the November vote on events, and specifically address the change in voting methods introduced by the US delegation. This effort is being coordinated on an international scale to provide coherence and consistency of message. All of this is supported by providing a well-qualified, articulate, unbiased and informed representative that will be present at ISAF meetings.

Chances of overturning the Estoril vote had been declining, but due to the efforts of sevenal key people around the world, renewed interest by the public from exposure in blogs, newsletters and magazines, and strangely enough by the wording in ISAF's own meeting minutes and regulations, I think that the tide is once again turning.


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: John Williams] #133830
03/06/08 10:51 AM
03/06/08 10:51 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 5,558
Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Mary  Offline
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John, I don't understand. What is the "request"?

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Mary] #133831
03/06/08 11:03 AM
03/06/08 11:03 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
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John Williams  Offline
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Hi Mary - that was my reply to Rex's post above:

Quote
A specific, actionable strategy, with timelines and decision scenarios would be useful for some comments. The ISAF have proven their tactical ability in steering this away from us. What is the plan of the MH community representatives?


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: John Williams] #133832
03/06/08 11:09 AM
03/06/08 11:09 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
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Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Mary  Offline
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Sorry, it is all too complicated for me. Just somebody please tell me exactly what I can do, and how. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Mary] #133833
03/06/08 11:18 AM
03/06/08 11:18 AM
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Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
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John Williams  Offline
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Let's see... first you could start some sort of newsletter tailored for multihull sailors of all sorts. Oh, you did that? Ok. Well, maybe you could help run some regattas - pick a class you like and put on some events. What? You already do that, too? Oh. Well, if you really want to help out, why not set up some sort of internet-based forum so that sailors from all over the world can communicate intantly with one another and... huh? Oh. Heh heh... of course. Well then - five stars for you.


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: John Williams] #133834
03/06/08 11:21 AM
03/06/08 11:21 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
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Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Mary  Offline
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No, no. I want to know exactly who I can write to and what I should be saying to them. And I think everybody else would like to know that, too.

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Mary] #133835
03/06/08 11:30 AM
03/06/08 11:30 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
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It was posted in an earlier post by rexdenton
Quote
PRESIDENT
Jacques Rogge............................. Belgium



VICE PRESIDENT(S)

Gunilla Lindberg............................. Sweden
Lambis V. Nikolaou............................. Greece
Chiharu Igaya............................. Japan
Thomas Bach............................. Germany




MEMBER(S)

Gerhard Heiberg............................. Norway
Denis Oswald............................. Switzerland
Mario Vázquez Raña............................. Mexico
Ottavio Cinquanta............................. Italy
Sergey Bubka............................. Ukraine
Zaiqing Yu............................. People's Republic of China
Richard L. Carrión............................. Puerto Rico
Ser Miang Ng............................. Singapore
Mario Pescante............................. Italia
Sam Ramsamy............................. South Africa




ADDRESS

Executive Board
Château de Vidy
1007 Lausanne
Switzerland

This is the IOC, the guys with the real power over the games.
A polite letter saying that you will miss the multihulls (and female high-performance dinghy) in the games can not hurt. Or what John?
BTW: Mr. Heiberg from Norway is both approachable and smart. Offending him would not be a good move, but showing a groundswell of interest would raise some questions.

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #133836
03/06/08 11:35 AM
03/06/08 11:35 AM
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Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Mary  Offline
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I know that was posted. But it doesn't give me any e-mail addresses for them. So how am I supposed to send them letters? Get real here. We need a way to contact them. And it is NOT realistic to expect people to mail them something overseas to that Executive Board address in Switzerland.

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Mary] #133837
03/06/08 11:41 AM
03/06/08 11:41 AM
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West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
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I dont think the IOC want emails. A real letter means a lot more.

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Mary] #133838
03/06/08 11:42 AM
03/06/08 11:42 AM

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Anonymous
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I agree it's strange that email addresses aren't published, but I went looking for them back when this thing first blew up and just couldn't find any.

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Mary] #133839
03/06/08 11:51 AM
03/06/08 11:51 AM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 297
R
rexdenton Offline
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rexdenton  Offline
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R

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Quote
Just somebody please tell me exactly what I can do, and how. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />


Mary, The best thing that you and Rick and everyone else with an interest is keep the topic on the board hot, urge fellow sailors to lobby the IOC to keep the pressure on the ISAF. It is pretty clear that the ISAF are not going to consider the MH community voice significant. I hope that with some effective lobbying on our part, the IOC can see through this and re-state their prior expectations for Olympic yachting to be exciting. Lest the ISAF EC look incredibly foolish before the IOC, they can be expected to take a strategy of burying their lousy Estoril decision in a procedural technicality (definition of 'urgent-honestly!). By keeping the topic hot on your boards here at catsailor.com, and by all of us lobbying the IOC executive board (Note to all!! Be Polite to the IOC!!) the pressure will remain on the ISAF MNA's and EC members to address the issue in an appropriate forum rather than allow a dismissal through a deceptive expedient(the rather incredible request of defintion of the word 'Urgent') by the ISAF Exec Cmte. The seem to be counting on the 'cure' needed to get them out of the mess will be time ('time will heal the MH communities wounds').

By digging in, ISAF EC have begun to look less like emissaries for the sport of yachting and more like politicians. It is worth letting the IOC know that the ISAF got rid of one of the most exciting boats in the sport of yachting. The ISAF now counts on this issue to die down in the MH community. If that happens, it quietly lets them off the hook for their messy, poorly planned, poorly executed decision process shown in Estoril.
R


Nacra F18 #856
Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: rexdenton] #133840
03/06/08 11:53 AM
03/06/08 11:53 AM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 297
R
rexdenton Offline
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rexdenton  Offline
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R

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Posts: 297
There is no email address for the IOC. You have to send a letter or fax.
R


Nacra F18 #856
Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #133841
03/06/08 11:54 AM
03/06/08 11:54 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
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Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Mary  Offline
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Quote
I dont think the IOC want emails. A real letter means a lot more.


No. 1, I don't think people these days are going to go to the trouble of sending a letter by snailmail, and it is expensive sending it from other places around the world.

No. 2, If you send a snailmail, how would we know that it is getting passed on to the person(s) we want to read it? Obviously, snailmail is going to be filtered by the Executive Secretary. Maybe if they gave their actual addresses for receiving real mail, that would be different.

But we really need e-mail addresses if they REALLY want to hear what sailors are saying. They DO have e-mail in Europe, don't they? <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

For the US Sailing people, all you have to do is click on their names, and you automatically can send them an e-mail. That's GOOD! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Mary] #133842
03/06/08 12:03 PM
03/06/08 12:03 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
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John Williams  Offline
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Mary, you're a dear and I'll never take away the stars I gave you. But you asked a question and got an answer. Your response seems to be, and I'm paraphrasing, that sending a letter is too much trouble, too expensive and probably won't do any good. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Mary] #133843
03/06/08 12:04 PM
03/06/08 12:04 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
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I am certain they have email adresses, but they dont make them public probably becouse they know they will be swamped with issues like ours. National sailing MNAs are usually reachable by email, but the IOC have choosen not to be accessible by email.
Certainly the secretaries will deal with regular mail, but if they get real letters they know people are really serious about it. There is a certain logic behind the reasoning, whether it is smart/good or not.
I think we will have to play by their rules if we are to influence them directly.

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: John Williams] #133844
03/06/08 12:11 PM
03/06/08 12:11 PM
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Key Largo, FL & Put-in-Bay, OH...
Mary Offline
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Mary  Offline
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Quote
Mary, you're a dear and I'll never take away the stars I gave you. But you asked a question and got an answer. Your response seems to be, and I'm paraphrasing, that sending a letter is too much trouble, too expensive and probably won't do any good. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Yes, that's EXACTLY what I am saying. If you want a lot of people to respond about an issue, you have to make it easy for them and give them a way to do it directly to a person who has some control or influence over the issue.

Re: Update on boats for 2012 Olympics [Re: Mary] #133845
03/06/08 12:26 PM
03/06/08 12:26 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,293
Long Beach, California
John Williams Offline
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John Williams  Offline
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I understand what you mean. However, to say that the last e-mail campaign to IOC on this matter was not well-recieved is understating the point. Rolf's right - they don't publish e-mail contact info for a reason. I suggest that if writing a letter is not something people are willing to do, then we have a pretty good approximation of how much this issue really means to them.


John Williams

- The harder you practice, the luckier you get -
Gary Player, pro golfer

After watching Lionel Messi play, I realize I need to sail harder.
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