Hi all,

I really haven't made up my mind either way, but I've been very curious about the IPCC "hockey stick" graph and it's lack of recognition of the Medieval warm period and little ice age. I came accross a very interesting article:
http://www.uoguelph.ca/~rmckitri/research/McKitrick-hockeystick.pdf
This article makes some quite compelling arguments that makes one wonder what's really going on at the IPCC. I encourage everyone to read it.

Al

I go away for a while and when I come back I find this topic on the first page. I am speechless........ <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

These idiots can't even predict when it is going to rain or not. Why should I be concern if they think the ice caps will melts?

That depends on if you live in Florida or not.

Hmmm, the idiots that's can't predict rain are weather men/women...not climate scientists.

I can't believe we're still at the level of "oh, it's cold today...therefore global warming is crap!" mentality.

Common folks, check out the peer reviewed studies and start understanding what we're all discussing!

Here's a few volcano facts I've dredged up:

1. Volcanoes contribute about 110 million tons of carbon dioxide per year while man's activities contribute about 10 billion tons per year.
2. Volcanoes actually cool the climate, at least temporarily for a few years after a major eruption, due to the increase in particulate matter they pump up high...but it soon settles out again.

Its a pity they didn't stick to calling it pollution and tell everyone to stop polluting the environment because everyone would agree and this subject would be dead and gone.

Global warming. If you truly and honestly believe in your cause, extreme measures must be taken. If humans are the sole cause of impending doom than the easiest solution is to have fewer humans. I don’t think anyone could argue that over population is a problem. We double our population every hundred years or less. For the most part what we as an individual doesn’t have any real effect. It is what is done as a collective that is causing an issue. As with any great cause sacrifices may have to be made, sacrifices that I honestly am not prepared or willing to do. Those of you who are enlightened as to what is going on have a calling or duty to change the ways of others. Unfortunately for you a great portion of the population is like myself and don’t care about your cause. In the off chance you can get someone to change their abusiveness of the environment by 10% you will have five more people to deal with needing that same amount of change in habits. My solution to you is that if you truly believe in your cause and that ultimate tragedy is unavoidable then you have to take matters into your own hands. A purging of all the non believers and the disposal of all of the undesirable peoples in the path of your goal must be dealt with in the most severe of ways. While walking the path of righteousness, whilst cleansing the planet of its infidels you may at some point realize that you too are part of the problem and that after your work is complete you will be finally able to make the most glorious of sacrifices and put an end to your destructive ways as well. To some this may sound severe, but you can’t let them cloud your judgment with blasphemes lies. Salvation of the planet rests in the elimination of human life. Only then will the planet be capable of returning to the way it was prior to our ways.
I would recommend something viral

BTW this is exactly what I hear when I listen to you nut jobs preach about the environment. You sound like a crusader or jihadist. To be truthful I see no downside to global warming. Extreme weather? Please, I live in the middle of a continent; weather doesn’t get much more extreme without going to a higher latitude. Three degrees warmer? Half of this winter was below zero this year, maybe it won’t cost so much to heat my frickin’ house. Oceans rising killing off polar bears? I don’t care. Now this doesn’t mean that we need to be dumping toxins into rivers, or that we should all be bicycling to work. Moderation needs to be exercised no matter what. Even without the figuring environmental factors the conservation of resources is a good plan but unrealistic. The only thing I agree with in the previous paragraph is that we have become so large in number that it is becoming a problem. Who knows what the limit of technology is. Fifty years ago they would have said our current population would be unsustainable. At some point we will become too many.
People say we have to relieve our dependency on petroleum. Good luck. There isn’t one single thing that is in front of me that isn’t effected by oil. It was either made from, contained in, transported by, or made with energy from oil. There are so many lies that are spewed out by the media and our politicians and is truly is impossible to wade through the lies to find the truth. Remember that movement means motive.

Karl
They were right 50 years ago.

I can agree to the two last sentences Karl wrote. As for the first part.. You should look a bit into the consequences of global heating or freezing. It is very scary stuff and just as bad as your idea about "offing" large parts of the population. Puts your post in a bit of a funny light when we know which parts of the population are consuming the lions share of the resources. Myself included..

Yeah, that whole thing hit my household for an hour one night too. After nearly killing myself trying to get around the house in the dark, I remarked how the energy saved by turning off the lights for one silly hour will easily be offset by additional energy used taking x-rays of broken toes and feet around the world.

(PS - the TV's stayed on).

Just picked up a couple of candle lantern's at REI today. Will use to heat our two person tent at the Youth Sailing campout at Potholes State Park this weekend. Looks like we will have about 50 kids, 6 Waves, and 4 Tigers. Night time temperature 32 deg F. Will let you know how it works out.

Worked fine when I was in the Army, but that was before we had Global Warming.

Caleb

Watched a very good documentary last night, about crude oil, what it is, how it is formed and what it does. Was well worth the hour and a half spent in front of the TV: Crude - The incredible journey of oil http://www.abc.net.au/science/crude/

Read an article that stated that the average temp has not increased in the last 10 years. They also said that Gore no longer calls it "Global Warming" but "Climate Change".

Also the ice shelf that broke off in Antartica is a normal occurance and the reports don't mention the vast areas of "new" ice formed in Antartica.

Someone is not telling the truth or at least omitting some of it... <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Clayton

Clayton and others.

The documentary I linked to is really worth to watch. It explains what oil is and how the "oil"-cycle works. It gives a good understanding of the mechanisms of what we debate here.

Yes, and yet another reminder about how much we really do need to kick the fossil fuels addiction. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

That means turning our lives back about 200 years. Good luck. Say goodbye to everything you like, and prepare to work your butt off and die young. Probably from starvation before anything else.

That would be great! But maybe only 100 years back. I wish I had been born when my parents were. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

EXCELLENT ARTICLE. That IPCC Group I have been suspicious of from Day 1. Any group that large that claims a consensus worries me # 1 and # 2 looking at the people involved in the organization made me skeptical with so many of them in fields that would have NO REASON to dabble in the climate change arena. Other than for grants and free money that is. Have you seen some of the requests for grants and what the proposed areas for study are? It seems that anyone that wants money to study something simply throws in that it has something to do with Climate Change and it's a given. The effects of toothpaste on newts and salamanders given a Climate Change environment. NO LIE, that was one proposed Grant Request to the Smithsonian.

Mark me down on the side that AL Gore and his ilk, promote this crap in order to gain worldwide acclaim and will say and do ANYTHING to foster it's continued existence.

Greg

Correct me if I am wrong but both fiberglass boats and rotomolded boats are petroleum based. Hell, is the kevlar, carbon, mylar, dacron in our sails. Petroleum usage has been around much longer than most people recognize, just not for fuels for cars.

Exactly the point. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />