If most kids start in monohulls, most kids will remain sailing monohulls.

There are too many mono classes trying to hook kids when they live the Optimist, but almost no entry or intermediate level cat class. We want the F12 to compete with those classes AND with the Optimist - even when the F12 designers have different views about the target age range and other details.

At least four sets of excellent F12 plans are available today. All of them are very inexpensive, simple to build, fast and safe. Will they converge to a one design class? I certainly hope so. It just isn't a priority right now.

All F12 models allow a girl to start sailing at 7 (two up) and eventually to sail singlehanded - forever, if her size and weight are normal or small.

All F12 models allow a boy to start sailing at 7 (two up) and eventually to sail singlehanded, until his weight requires a bigger cat, like an F16, H16 or F14; typically at 17 years old.

The first boats are being built now and sail numbers have already been assigned. Let your kids choose a model and help bring this wonderful class to life. If you start early enough, you will have a great story to tell the grandsons: your pioneer participation in the startup of the class they will sail.

All the best,

I certainly have been doing that. My six year old says he does not need sailing classes in small boats because he "already drives the big ones".

I'm hoping I'll have to give one of my boats to the kids.

This is what kinda happened to me.

I was lucky that I went to school before the health-and-safety-executive and the PC muppets got involved with school.

I learned to Crew with one of my teachers at school.

I was then lucky that my dad wanted to sail too, and the most important thing was that he waw willing to crew for me to start with

He then moved to a boat of his own and I then got may own boat.



IF my kids want to sail, my sailing will have to take a back foot for a few years.

I'll drag them around in what they choose to sail, and if the place we are sailing allows cats, I'll take the F16 and sail that while they sail.

No doubt they will start crewing for me, and as soon as they want (or I think they are ready) they will get the chance to helm.



If they don't want to sail, then so be it.


The way things are going, they may be more interested in Ski racing than sailing, but that could work out very expensive.

Joy from the Ski holiday I went on recently was watching my son ski past his god father the second time we took him down a red run.

If they don't give it up, IMHO they've got their priorities messed up. Whether it be sailing, ball, dancing, whatever, support and encourage the kids in their formative years.

and by the way...

WE ARE KANSAS!!!

I can't speak for "most sailors" but that is what I have done, last year I switched clubs from a catamaran club to a child freindly club with a great cadet section that uses Oppi's.

This year a couple of other people from my old club have done the same. I don't see this as abandoning cat sailing, but more as part of a long term plan to increase my time on the water.

I have just qualified as an instructor in order to teach other Cadets to sail. I am a supporter of the F12 concept for young kids 7 and up, but I would not advocate starting them on anything other than a suitable small monohull like an Oppi. I intend to introduce an F12 to my club in the near future.

THis approach teaches them the right skills and with the big numbers involved in Oppi sailing it shows them that the social side of sailing is great as well. I think the social aspect is the bit that will keep them hooked, and if they learn to sail as well and occasionaly take their Dad out for a sail then I beleive it will be time well spent.

Gareth

[quote I think the social aspect is the bit that will keep them hooked, and if they learn to sail as well and occasionaly take their Dad out for a sail then I beleive it will be time well spent.

Gareth [/quote]

Whatever you do don't get them so hooked they decide to go into the industry. There is no money to be made that way. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

You are right on about everything you said and everything you are doing, Gareth. Kids want to be with other kids. And they really need to learn to sail a boat solo first, to build their confidence in their ability to control a boat on their own.

And it is not just about sailing. Learning how to be in command of your own vessel is a life experience that will help you with confidence in all walks of life even if you never sail again after childhood.

Remote control sailboats is a good way to teach kids sailing theory. I have been able to teach the bright ones how to do it in 10 minutes. They approach it as a 3D video game. The concept of the difference between tacking & jibing is much easier to show/teach with a model because the learning experience has a birds eye view of the sails interaction with the invisible wind.

"let's say it was small catamarans and those catamarans had a network like the Optimists have."

That is a VERY big IF, IMO. We have enough trouble trying to keep a regular cat group going. Sure, if we never start we never get there, but that is a HUGE goal to hit for a bunch of minority-group sailors. If I wanted to sacrifice my time, would I want to sacrifice MORE time to start a whole new group, or would I just take the easy option? Well, you already know I'm a lazy selfish bastard; I'm gonna dump 'em off at the dock and sit at the YC bar while they sail Optis. I'm sure not gonna build 'em a boat. Again, some people do all that; more power and great respect for them. Most of the people I sail with aren't that motivated. I've never had trouble stealing kids off Optis; it's the 30 year olds who are hard sells.

I've been taking my kids out on various boats since they were babies. They like going out on our keelboat because it's family time, they like to go to the vberth when it's heeled and bouncy, and we try to go to fun destinations for them. I belong to a sailing club that has mostly dinghies. The kids can't join or go out on their own, because it is a college club (which allows alumni to retain their membership, thus why I'm still there). My kids usually have to be coerced to go dinghy sailing, but once we are out they have a good time. So they have been on a Pico, Bravo, Laser, FJ, Flying Scot, Hobie 16, and a Hobie 20 as crew. When they were 8 (twins) they took a sailing lesson at Sail Sand Point, it was mostly in Optis. My daughter thought the lessons were ok, but wasn't very excited by the Opti. My son has always told me, "Dad, you know sailing is more your thing." On one class they went out on the Hobie Wave, when they got back I asked how it went, my son said, "of course when it's windy and it's a cat it's fun." SSP has a great deal of a $1 season pass for kids Optis. Everytime we went to go sailing, it was a battle to get them to go Opti sailing, they always wanted to go Wave sailing. They weren't big enough to be allowed to sail the Waves. I had joined and would quite often cave in and take them Wave sailing. The next summer because of scheduling problems we didn't do SSP. (It also didn't help that they whined about the Optis everytime lessons came up.) Since they had taken the lesson with a friend, I tried to arrange for them to be together in a class this coming summer and was discussing possible classes her Dad. His daughter wasn't excited about the Optis either. SSP has a cruise to a destination and eat lunch camp on the Waves that they might be old enough for. (Lower age 10 or 11 depending on where you look on the web page.) That is the only camp/class that I could find that uses the Waves there. They also have Hobie 16s, but we're about 3 years away from being old enough for that. I came up with an alternate solution, I asked the other Dad if he wanted to go in on a Hobie 14 for our kids. It was cheaper than a week of lessons for my twins. It's the kind of boat that they want to sail, and they are going to be able to sail without adults onboard and the 3 of them will get to sail together. They also weren't having much fun singlehanding. We haven't even had the boat in the water yet, so I don't know if this is going to work, but instead of my kids whining everytime I mention sailing lessons, they are at least semi excited about owning a boat.

I think SSP is a great organization, but I think it wouldn't be a bad idea for them to have more classes using the Waves, particularly since apparently I have ruined my kids for Optis by allowing them to sail cats.

I guess it could be pointed out that I should have worked within the system to make cat sailing more accessable to other junior sailors rather than opting out and buying my own boat. Well now that I've thought of it, maybe I'll see if there is something I could do in that direction.

John

I started the thread "First Boat?" after reading this thread for a while. So far, not one person has responded saying they learned to sail on an Opti. That tells me that an Opti may be a good boat for a kid to learn how to sail, but not a good boat to learn to love sailing. I know the Opti has been around forever, so it's not a matter of age. Maybe the Opti-kids all stick with monohulls, maybe it's like soccer (which now seems MANDATORY for kids, but is never played again).

Nevertheless, I did find it interesting to see how many of us did start on some kind of smaller monohull. Perhaps the problem with the Opti is that it is only found in such an intensive, regulated environment. In considering my own initial experience, my totally unsupervised crashing about on my Sea Snark in the bay seemed to instill the free-spirit attitude that ultimately drew me toward cat sailing.

could also be that many of started in areas Opti free!! Opti are not huge here even today. We had Pelicans & mudlarks as the first series of learner boats.. VJs were before them, but in reality not a great trainer as your 10% in control in a blow on a VJ and 90% wondering what is happening or more likely what happened!!

I learned to sail in an Optimist. I believe it was in 1971 at age 11. They are excellent sailing schools for dinghies, not for cats.