So much for that ol... All boats must have and show proof of liability insurance! This was probably a requirement to race in the first place. (The foolish common practice these days in small boat regattas)

Since this butt x hole obviously does not have liability insurance... Is the organizing authority responsible because they did not make good on checking that he in fact had valid liability insurance?

When her lawyer sues him for her loss .... why not sue the poor SOB running the regatta for negligence as well..( bet ya he has some assets that will be taken to pay her bills (not to mention the lawyer, which is her only way to make this guy pay the bills)

And then there is the whole weather thing. When is the Race Committee going to call a race to avoid libility if half the fleet is upside down and somebody gets hurt? What if they don't stop the race? Are they "Liable"? In America anyone can sue anyone for any reason or no reason.

forget what the RC wants to do. Yes, they aren't doing anyone any favors necessarily running a race in extreme winds but it is still the skipper who needs to take responsibility. none of this should fall on the RC unless there is stupid over the top negligence (which, I guess, could mean setting the marks in 6 inches of water and causing a bunch of crashes.. I guess). If someone wants to play the - "but it will hurt my standing in the regatta if I don't go out" then whatever.

What were people's opinions several years ago (was it the 2007 tybee?) when the race was being started in significant surf? Did people hold it against the RC or what (I seriously don't remember, wasn't there)? I knwo a bunch of people didn't start which was their decision and apparently a good one.

And yes, insurance should be required to race. I was going to get umbrella insurance last year but found that some wouldn't cover me if I raced sailboats. kind of goofy...

I just wanted to hear other opinions rather than my own on the subject. I've been in a few situations in my life where the driver had no regard for the safety of the passengers and it really pissed me off. The guy in question CLEARLY had no remorse for the victim while he was standing there laughing about the damage and the victim was in transit to the hospital.

I am glad this is being discussed here.. I am learning from it.

I also forgot to mention in my post, that as a human being, that man sucks and should be publicly ridiculed... or stoned... whatever is easier.

How would they be negligent? Bad weather is an act of god and the skipper of each boat out there is responsible for their boat and crew.... the rules are very clear who's responsibility it is to continue to race.... it's always the captain! The judgment of the RC does not undercut the captains responsibility.

But that is why regatta liability insurance exists. It will defend you the PRO and all RC from such a frivolous law suit and costs you about 400 per year.

IMO, This is different then making a claim... "All boats will have liability insurance"... and then not performing the act of verifying insurance coverage adequately or at all.

Not verifying insurance liability is a possibly negligent act that will get you in the middle of the legal mess for no good reason.

The feel good requirement will have inserted your organization (or yourself if not incorporated) into the legal mess between two parties. I do not understand why clubs and class associations insist on this.

So in order to sail with a well covered skipper all crew must:
Show proof of health insurance
Pass a basic seamanship course (in case the skipper is incapacitated and the crew must sail the boat to shore)
pass a swim test
be certified in first aid/CPR
wear necessary safety equipment (pfd, helmet, shoes, gloves)
know how to operate VHF, Flares, PLB, GPS
sign a liability waiver

Pete's right (did I just say that).....we all need to sail singlehanded boats!

anyone who operates any boat should have insurance, regardless of racing.

About a great many things.

Agreed, this guy is a piece of work. You don't have to pay money to be a decent person and at least follow up on your crew's injury.

Andrew, I don't know what you're learning. Until someone posts the results from this lawsuit, the rest is just random assorted opinion. Such as:

In anything that you do in life, there are risks. If you have stuff that you value (including your health and well being for the rest of your life), you should insure yourself (including insurance for liability). God knows, no two lawsuits seem to end the same way.

Mike

Guys (and Gals),

First let me state that I do carry insurance on my boats and I would have gone to the hospital ...

Now if it can be proved that the skipper in question had prior knowledge of the frontcrossbar to being defective ... he's in trouble ... if he had no prior knowledge it will make the issue of accessing/assigning fault more difficult. But as this skipper was previously a "professional rigger" an argument can be made that he should have had additional knowledge that he should have used to access the P19's seaworthyness ... this could be a interesting case study.

FYI: Realize there are 50,000,000 people in the United States that do not have any medical coverage currently ... that is approximently 1 in 6 persons .... maybe we as citizens of the USA need to fiqure out a way that provides medical coverage to everyone like they have been able to do in all the other "western industrialized" countries??? (Just want everyone to think about this fact)

Secondly, just as a sidenote and (I have had the "discussion" w/ several unfriendly waterfront landowners and police over the years) ... International Maritine Law states that a skipper is responcible for the safety of his crew and vessel .... and due to equipment failure or weather conditions may seak "safe haven" at any place the skipper deems neccesary. So if your crew is injured or your boat is broken as skipper you can land anywhere and seek "safe haven" for your crew and vessel.... so the wreckage of the P19 could have been brought ashore anywhere it could be dragged to.

Now let's just think also of the responcibility of the race commitee and "INSURANCE" .... if Small Craft Advisories were "Up", do you think that the race commitee can be sued??? Or maybe the RC should be respouncible to inspect all boats for insurance coverage????

Lots of "sticky" questions here ....

HarryMurphey

[o in order to sail with a well covered skipper all crew must:
Show proof of health insurance
No... skippers liability will cover any injury to the crew.

Pass a basic seamanship course (in case the skipper is incapacitated and the crew must sail the boat to shore)
DUH! don't you make sure your crew can turn the boat around and get you if the conditions are dicey! Otherwise... I am not going out.

pass a swim test
DUH!

be certified in first aid/CPR
Not necessary

wear necessary safety equipment (pfd, helmet, shoes, gloves)
DUH would you take anyone on your boat without the right gear!

know how to operate VHF, Flares, PLB, GPS
DUH... if you need this safety margin for that day ... you betcha I show them how it all works and have them try it!

sign a liability waiver
Waiver's are useless in a court of law.

Pete's right (did I just say that).....we all need to sail singlehanded boats!

No... we all need to use common sense and good seamanship and protect ourselves with liability insurance from expensive disasters.

That is not true at all... it establishes an understanding of risk. It is true you can not waive neglagence... but if there was no neglagence... a waiver could save you from paying out damages... thats why ski mountains have a disclaimer on every lift ticket, as do every sporting event ticket... etc...

I agree with your clarification...

In the end, the Skipper, the PRO, and the Regatta Chairman/Sailing Club will all be sued. The lawyers will get something out of all of them, but you have to be prepared as a skipper for this, whether accident, or negligence.

I thought there was a similar issue in the Sydney-Hobart race that year (was it like, 2001? or earlier?) where lots of people died due to capsized boats, etc. when a huge typhoon came through the fleet during the race. There were many lawsuits against lots of skippers who lost crew, and the RC as well, for not delaying the start until after the storm had passed. I don't know what the final outcome was for the RC or the skippers in question.

Like I said before, anyone can sue anyone for -any- reason, real or imagined. Been there, done that.

Lee:

You are entirely correct and part of being a responsible skipper is carrying insurance regardless if you race or not, it not only covers what happens on your boat but any property or personal injury caused to others; ie t-boning your friend's boat. In the case you presented, even if the crew had health insurance, she would likely have out-of-pocket expenses for deductibles, coinsurance, copays, and lost wages. God forbid if there is rehab or partial disability relating to her injuries. Odds are that she will find an attorney, they will sue and prevail because boats are expected to be seaworthy in conditions that they were sailing in. Hopefully, he has enough assets to cover the judgement. They could always garnish wages. Too bad debtors jail does not exist for this creep because he deserves it.

Not carrying insurance on your boat is like not having life insurance when you are a parent of young children, totally unacceptable and irresponsible. Pennywise and pound foolish!


Kris Hathaway
F-16
WRCRA/WRSC

I would think that the RC/PRO CAN be held at least partially liabile for incidents as a result of starting races in extreme weather.

I am not an attorney, but part of the PRO's responsibility should be to have a rough idea of the design and performance envelopes for the vessels in the regatta. If the OBSERVED weather conditions are beyond that envelope, it could be considered negligence on the part of the PRO to start or continue a race.

Would it be a good idea to start a race when lightning is striking all around? Most likely not... Why? Because you are posing an undue risk to the participants...

Would it be smart to start a race when it is blowing well over 20 kts, knowing that most of the boats aren't designed for that kind of wind? I know most sailors could handle it, but what if there were an accident and injury?

Could the prosecuting attorney argue that the PRO should have known the conditions were dangerous and postponed the race? Would the PRO have expected a greater than average chance for boat damage and/or participant injury? I would think this may have traction to a jury...

That being said, I still think it's the skipper's primary responsibility to ensure the safety of the vessel and crew.

don't all entry forms applications have to sign and agree that they must sail under their decision and not to sail in conditions out of their abilities? this is a disclaimer meant to release the RC of liabilities.