Are there two different groups of sailors that participate or is it the same gang?

Exactly What are the ACATS doing Dave?
All we are are the old guys who got tired of hauling backbreaking boats up the beach, who got tired of searching for crew, Who like to sail FAST, Don't mind welcoming a boat someone built in his garage, and still like to sail a one-design class.
Is there some perception we're doing something wrong or exclusionary?
We're more open than anyone except the F-16 fleet, only in that fact that we can't sail 2UP as an option.
I couldn't sail my 5.5 as an F-18 even though it met the measurements. You can sail a homebuilt Woody or an LR3 in A-Class.

It's rare anymore that one would feel unwelcome at a regatta.

One thing I've noticed. Our local Monohull fleet has a Leukemia Cup every year. Our participation started to dwindle in the bouy racing. So they started a long distance course on Saturday for folks that wanted to do that. Participation has soared. They had 27 boats in the distance race and only 4 in the spinnaker division of the bouy racing. Which is a complete turn around.

They do a reverse start like the mug race. So no big starting line problems.

Maybe we should try this as part of our regular regatta's? Might draw more people just to come out and cruise the course and see how they do. If you think it will take away from your bouy racing, it doesn't. The serious racers still seem to choose the bouy racing.

PS. The "distance" is pretty short. For Cat's I'd recommend under 20 miles total depending on wind and direction.

Mike Hill

There is overlap but how much I can't be sure, and I'm thinking there may not be all that much, I suspect you think differently.

Speaking for myself, I fall into the "serious racer" bucket and I'll probably pass on the flying the hull contest and such heck I can't attend the all the race focused regatta's I want to go to now so those types of events (for me) get a pass.

Ask yourself why Andrew Scott and his crew won't drive the 30 minutes (probably less) to race with the GYC folks (good friendly group too), and I'm pretty sure you won't catch the A cat crowd doing power reaches with Andrew and his peeps. I'm really thinking these two groups are really quite seperate. The common ground is the party, everyone loves a good party.

Does someone that considers themselves a serious racer trade a race regatta for a non-race regatta? Can a race and non-race event coexist at the same venue?

The SEACATS used to have 2 "funsails" a year. Bothe distance "races", but no trophies, nothing serious, just take off and sail. New Years day is still kinda that way, but just fast boats have shown up recently.

When and where do we want to start something going again?

Cary the Acat fleet has several A cat only events a year. That's all I'm saying I wasn't taking a shot just making an observation. It appears to be working for the fleet too.

Please explain: I couldn't sail my 5.5 as an F-18 even though it met the measurements

Oh Cary, for the record... an A cat is probably my next stop. Hopefully it's going to be several more years I love where I am now.

I wasn't trying to present a loaded question - I really don't know what crowds attend either regatta.

I’ve been watching this thread and have almost commented a few times but have stayed out of it. But, I feel like I need to add my 2 cents.
I would still consider myself a “new” sailor. I’ve only been sailing for about four years now, maybe a little more or less. I’ve only sailed a Hobie 16. I bought my boat from a buddy’s dad on a whim, before I had ever been on one or knew much about sailing. It is still one of the best purchases I have ever made.
I love to sail recreationally, but as of last year I’ve been bitten by the regatta bug pretty badly. I’ve attended Trey’s race in Raleigh, Sail the Bay twice, the Virginia Beach Version Race, Tommy Whiteside, Spring Fever, and the Duck Cup. With the exception of the Raleigh race they are all 3+ hours away from where I live. That being said, I will continue to attend these regattas because I am made to feel so welcome and that’s why I will continue to load my boat, fill my tank, and drive to all of those places again and again. I’ve met several of the people that are posting on this thread, and from my perspective they are all A+ dudes. Whether they have helped me rig my boat, given me a little advice, or let me drool over their immaculate high performance boats as they sit by my junker 16, they have never made me feel unwelcome. What I love so much about these regattas is that everyone is a sailor first, which boat you sail is a matter of personal preference. The last Sail the Bay was the first out of all the regattas I’ve attended that I wasn’t in dead last place. I have the sailors at these regattas to thank for that. It is their encouragement and help that motivates me to keep attending and try to improve as a racer.
That being said, I don’t know what the answer is to get more new people on boats and attend regattas. I do it just because I love it. Like someone else said on this thread, it is a lot of work to sail. I think that alone turns off a lot of people. I’ve been trying for years to convince all of my friends to buy a boat…. none have. Sailing takes a certain amount of dedication and time that some people aren’t willing to give.
But, before I make this any longer I’ll sign off by offering my opinion as “one” newish sailor out there showing up to these regattas. I have been made to feel very welcome regardless of who I am racing against (ie. Open or one design) or where it is located. After I have become a better sailor and have done this for a few more years I may have a different opinion about the whole one design or open class debate, but as for right now I am happy to go places where I feel like my 86 hobie and I fit in and where there are folks that jump at the opportunity to help out a newbie. See you guys at the Duck Cup.

Ding:
I'm not trying to be confrontational.
A-CLASS On a local level we're just finally glad to have built a class that has 5 boats showing up on the starting line again.
_____
Nacra 5.5 SL/spi to the best of my knowledge met the specs for an F-18 but would not be grandfathered into the class since it was not originally manufactured as an F-18.
________
Also if your F18 crew weight and sails don't match, ya can't race ,only that rule doesn't alway apply to everyone. . . and I'm not explaining that one, If ya don't know about it you might not have been paying attention.
I really hate that this is on topic but is several issues of this thread all at once.

James may have hit the nail on the head. If you arent into sailing, hanging out with a bunch of people who are infatuated with it might not fit your bill. Also, some new people grew up getting a "participation Trophy"....Sorry, you got to suffer a lot of defeats to start winning in sailboat racing...still doing alot of it myself.
Some people we just cant help into our sport

Cary, get back to work! Or go change my tires!

As for the 5.5 thing... you can build an F18 in your back yard and as long as it measures in it's good to go. So, if the 5.5 measures then I don't see an issue with it. If I've missed a rule please point it out.

As for the crew weight and sail plan, yes that's an area of contention and depending on event the wiggle room will vary. If you got screwed and it was me I apoligise for that, if it wasn't me then I can't address it. I can tell you this, I've never sent anyone home that had a weight and sail plan issue. I gave them the stink eye, but they sailed. If you felt that a team should not have been on the water you could have protested and they would have been flicked.

If your talking about Mosley's non stock sails that never got measured... he was always allowed to sail and yes he got a boot in the nuts but he was allowed to sail.

If the regatta is nationals the rules will be followed to the letter of the law though, no wiggle room.

Jake, I'm coming this weekend to BWYD also known as the couples regatta. I will most likely not buoy race day one, in order to get ourselves accustomed to my new boat, but will race day 2. No need for a cruising course for me, I will most likely just "screw" around on the lake, and pick your brain

By the way, I come to regattas because it's just too much fun and would not want to miss out... But honestly the support of my wife and her interest plays a HUGE roll, and if she was not interested in sailing, the regatta people, camping, racing and crewing it would not be such a given.

So getting the significant other interested and having something for them to do (if they are not crewing) is in my opinion important to cat sailing and regattas.

Man, this is out of hand, thrown under the bus again.
My sails came from an F18 certified sailmaker(Landenberger)
Dont put me in Cary's fight, he's talking about something else entirely different.

Bjorn, cant wait to see the new boat!

Nope, your Landenberger sails would have to be measured. We allowed sails that came stock with the boat to be 'certified' (this was a US thing) but not after market or third party sails. I'm pretty sure Traci told you that, she was a by the book kind of girl.

Dave, Im not going to argue about this on this site, but that aint how it happened.
Had Traci told me that, i would have felt pretty unwelcome at those regatta's though....

Did I mention I had an A Cat now?

I drove 3.5hrs to go to a day race which turned into a drifter about a month ago and the club kept announcing over the PA system that club members must prepurchase their tickets for the club member only dinner that night. Luckily us non members were able to buy a sausage sandwich before the 3.5hr drive home. When we organise our regattas we make sure there's cheap food and drink so that every one knows they're welcome and if we get blown out there's still a buzz around the club
regards

Ding:
Mosley doesn't own an F-18. He ain't in this discussion.
I been stewing on this for a while, The only real problem here is the preponderance of RULES.
I read the RRS cover to cover twice a year at least, Still learning them. Too damn Complicated to promote fun. . .
Ther are so many rules for so many situations, how can a new person EVER make sense of it all?
Lunatic Ravings edited for Content
Maybe a good Solution would be to Get Sammy and Valter in a locked room together somewhere, Just enough beer to make it friendly, and throw out every rule that can't be understood or just pisses someone off cause it's stupid or too damn complicated.
That would fix us.

Hey, how about this a deterrent to fun, random, recreational sailing:
Trying to get a rating for my F31. There is a "local" organization that provides these ratings. In order to get a rating I need my boat weight (not easy) and then have all my sails measured by a sailmaker - or competitor. Not worth it for one or two regattas a year. I guess it makes sense if you are serious about it, but I was going to get a rating to do one regatta. I think it would take a full day to take the sails off, either take it to a sailmaker (and how much do they charge?) or waste someone else's time, then put them back on.

yes... it suddenly occurred to me that you guys have to do this (I think) for a lot of the class events, but seems super painful to me.


Another thing that makes me not want to do regattas is the yelling that occurs at times. I crewed on a J29 for a year or so for fun, club level, races. The amount of screaming and yelling and name calling made me wonder why the hell anyone would voluntarily put themselves into that position.

And yes, there are so many rules (which there has to be I think) that I can't keep anything straight. I can sort of figure them out if I can think about it for a few minutes... but I chose to bail in on-the-water situations when I don't have the time to think about it and feel 100% certain I am in the right.

This board is turning into a bitch-fest...and I'm not talking about the posts.