Actually... it was a bad call.
Let me see if I convince you why...

Pt 1: Would you have wanted to wait so the RC could start the Tornado on the long course?

A: Not applicable here. The Tornado was originally scheduled to sail with the H18s and the H20 - short course. The T would have been finished and ready to go before the H18s and H20.
In any case, after the first start, subsequent starts were not constrained to waiting for all starts to finish before starting again. The only way the F-18s would have had to wait for the T to finish is if the T was sailing the same start...


Pt 2: His game was to sail fast and take his time against the first F18's and do his own math.

A: His game was to race Portsmouth, recruit another 4 T's for a class start, or recruit a class of like spinnaker boats to sail against. I don't know about you - but in my area of the country one typically gets on the phone and makes a few calls to encourage people to come out and race. The F-18 class did just this. Mike could have done likewise.
Secondly, no one was recording time for the F-18s, so the T would have to record his time and that of the F-18s in order to determine where he was finishing relative to the fleet.


Pt 3: Unless you paid extra for your separate start, I think the RC call was reasonable.

A: The F-18s paid for the regatta and showed up under the impression that they had paid for a class start. They also organized participation and travel to Santa Barbara as a class in order to race as a class. So they did more than just pay their entry fee. And they were promised more that just "a start". They were promised a class start.


Pt 4: Putting the spin boat on the short course with the non spin boats would be less safe.

A: What?


Pt 5: The issue is bad sportsmanship...

A: That's a ripe comment to make. If anything, the intention of the race organizer (who is a member of the F-18 fleet and was also a race participant) was to make the regatta enjoyable for Mike. However the results of this decision demonstrate that it didn't turn out this way. The truth is that it was eminently foreseeable that this wouldn't work out - ergo - NOT a good decision. Well intentioned - but not well practiced.


My recommendation to all race committees in a similar position is to stick to the advertised plan and not to repeat something similar to what happened here.

In truth I believe it was a bit of a set up for Mike. As far as I could tell he was OK sailing with the H18s and the H20. The RC probably should not have asked him what class he would like to sail with. Obviously it was no surprise that he might prefer to sail with more like boats - i.e. the F-18s. By the same token Mike might have anticipated that it wasn't a good idea to request this - which comes back to the earlier topic (several posts back).

And just as a final point - while there was some frustration among the F-18 fleet with the T being in the same start, and while Mike may have periodically felt somewhat unwelcomed sharing the start with the F-18 fleet - as far as I could tell everyone in attendance was glad to see each other on the water and off despite whatever technical issues arose on the water from an ill conceived management error.

Cheers,
Christopher

I'm sorry to say that you all F18 sailors who called Mike names or refused his ROW are wrong. You are struggling for excuses, you are trying to put the omen on the RC, but you are all flat wrong.

A boat is racing the same course as you, you are all bound by the same rules. It doesn't matter how the score is calculated. It doesn't even matter if he started at the same time as you. You *have* to extend to this odd duck the same sportsmanship you extend to your fellow F18. No excuses.

If you are not doing it, well, you're an butt. And you deserve being protested and disqualified. Hell, if you were real sailor you would disqualify yourself for poor sportmanship.

Mike is 100% right in being pissed off.

Camera on the top of the mast. Camera in the car. Press criminal charges once you have proof. This is unacceptable behavior.

Heck, I understand why you want to change club.

A boat racing on a different course, overlapping your racing area, and you are still bound by the racing rules.



I dont believe it, are you serious? I would be out of the club in an instant with a letter to the commodore (if there was alternative clubs). The bullys would win, but if members are like that I would not want to be part of it. Or I might try to be elected for the board..

[
I dont believe it, are you serious? I would be out of the club in an instant with a letter to the commodore (if there was alternative clubs). The bullys would win, but if members are like that I would not want to be part of it. Or I might try to be elected for the board.. [/quote]

They just kept pushing their trailers or beach dollys into my boat, when I caught them doing it they were apologetic and claimed it was an accident but plenty of times I came back to my boat after changing into my wetsuit to find another trailer grinding away at my boat, so I started moving around the rigging area each week but the damage still followed my boat while other boats remained untouched.
One of the windshield notes told me if I wanted to stop the scratches and dings I should move my boat 30km south ( location of another club).
The commodore sails a Sharpie, never had a problem with him, I didn't mention the notes to anyone as I was hoping to hear of them from another source and backtrack them.

Its over now,

Darryn

Darryn,

I am very sorry to hear your story. I hope the new club is better. Shame on those sailors at the old club (I have some other words I would like to use, but not here and now)!

Darryn, you haven't lost a thing. Good sailing to you.

Darryn,I am appalled by your last post. That is not only poor sportsmanship, but that is criminal. I STRONGLY feel a letter to the commodore describing what happened (to your boat) and the notes. If nothing else, perhaps this would prevent it from happening to another sailor.

I am sorry you sail with such jerks..

The commodore knows. . .and approves.

Who's the club? Folks should know so they won't be put through the same grief.
I think I'd do a little careless dolly handling (directed at the proper targets) before I left. Yeah, I know 2 wrongs don't make a right,but it lowers blood pressure and prevents worse things from happening.

Sounds like a job for a $500.00 Hobie(no offence meant to Hobie), can you say dam the torpedoes "RAMMING SPEED", I'm willing to contibute $50.00 bucks to the Dull the Sharpie Campaign. Any one else?

Get a TheMightyHobie18 for maximum effect.

This is turning ugly...

Not if you yell "PORT" in a fiendly mannor, while giving the thumbs up as you sail over their bows. Thanks to kick up rudders it will only take a second or two drop them back down and look for another target in a "target rich environment"

Where did you come up with this information? No one in the F-18 fleet called Mike names, nor did anyone in the F-18 fleet refuse Mike ROW.

If exasperation was expressed that Mike was sailing as a unscored boat along with the F-18 fleet, it was simply that. Allow me emphasize again that by asking to sail with the F-18 start, Mike gave up the opportunity to actually sail in a fleet where finish times were recorded and where he might have been able to at least have a handicap result. As it was, he instead chose to sail among the F-18s whose times were not recorded, and thus his time on course was not recorded.
He further put himself in the situation to affect the race outcome of the F-18 fleet - which did in fact happen. What was the point?! Really? It is not a question of bad sportsmanship - only a very realistic expression of a bad decision on the part of the race committee and also on the part of Mike by not seeing the non-sense in moving Mike to this start. I think this, and only this, is what the F-18 fleet was expressing.

Some simple questions..

1, Was Mike RACING - I belive the answer to be YES
2, Were the F18's RACING, I believe the answer to be yes

Thus BOTH Mike on the T and the F18s are bound by the RRS. POrt gives way to stbd; w to L etc...

Sounds like someone/people are tring to cover them selves are being idoits on the course; IF boats are racing; they obey the ruules or get DSQ. Simple.

As for Darren, Get outa there pronto with a letter to the Commadore. Where is this club, what is it called I'll not be joining.

I tired yelling "PORT" at Parker last week... (as i cut in front of him). His responce was "I am on the phone" (and he was) hahaha...

I see both sides of the story here...Port Starboard, room at the mark, etc. ABSOLUTELY they are due and nobody should or could argue otherwise. This is part of the deal with racing on a mixed course.

However, things change when the bigger boat, who is not formally being scored against, engages tactically with boats racing in a tight one-design race to the disadvantage of the smaller boat who doesn't even know he's in a battle. For starters, the larger boat has a performance advantage making a duel a loosing battle for the smaller boat and one they can not only win, but one they cannot escape. Even in a Portsmouth fleet, you don't typically get into these duels because it only serves to slow the big boat down and reduce the chance of getting the separation needed for the win. I can see how an F18 crew could be frustrated if there were these tactical battles happening with a Tornado while they were duking it out in their fleet.

Wow.... I mean really.... Wow.

Please allow me to repeat what I just wrote:
"No one in the F-18 fleet called Mike names, nor did anyone in the F-18 fleet refuse Mike ROW."

Now, can I ask why Pepin and Scooby Simon want to claim the situation was otherwise? Nobody that was there has made the claims that P and SS have made here.

Respectfully,
Christopher

I can assure you that more name calling and unsportsmanlike behavior is going on here than occurred at the regatta.