I think if buying a modern F16-based machine, you have more credibility if you enter a regatta assuming that handicap. The only reason skippers should nominate a more favourable handicap is if they are one of only a few competitors with varied handicaps.

Basically, if I were to buy a Viper, I am seeking to compete as an F16. Simple really.

While on the subject, is there any evidence to back the conspiracy theory that AHPC is not supporting an F16 culture or is in any way attempting to sabotage your formula?

I read lots of sensational accusations (read: juvenile whinging and name-calling) but no actual substance.

Re dumping of F18 vs F16 handicap, I have not raced either enough to give a qualified answer so I won't.

I've no knowledge of AHPC's intentions, but from what I've seen they're just trying to sell boats and promote catamaran sailing; and doing a very good job at both.

Fwiw, I've seen F18s and F16s on the same course often. The finishes seem to be related more to skill than handicap.

I defer to your greater experience.

Respectfully, I don't believe F16 will inherit sailors from the F18 ranks on the grounds that most of the F18 combinations probably need the bigger platform and have a steady, established team.

I can't agree more with you regarding AHPC's intentions. I submit that a few contributors need to ease back on their invective - such a tactic will probably ease their blood pressure... It will certainly lend greater credibilty to the F16 community (vis a vis Mr Marlow's "dogs" comment).

In all respect Dodsy if you had been around for a while on this forum, you would perhaps understand my statement, the biggest "stirrers" and "waffle artists" sadly seem to be Aussie based.

Now if you are not a "stirrer" and "waffle artist" then you can exclude yourself and any similar minded Aussie sailor, from being a "dog" and join into the banter of this forum.

Can't speak for anyone else, but as I get older (I am a very fit 56) my tolerence for things like lugging around a 400lb boat has passed, especially when a much lighter weight alternative exists with the added benefit of a lower cost.

As all of us baby boomers get older, weght of the platform will become more of an issue. The weight minimum that Macca and his associates fight to increase is one of the major draws of the F16, one that can pull sailors and would be sailors from other active and dead one design and formula classes who refuse to abandon outdated excessive minimum weights.

I rest my case.

Wayne, just because I haven't posted before doesn't mean I haven't been around for a while. It was your all-encompassing descriptions of Australians as dogs with no qualification which finally goaded me into speaking.

I won't bother with further contribution (which will probably make you happy) until a more positive strain enters the debate... Response only dignifies the insults.

Agreed.

When I get too old to lug the F16 around; I'll buy an A.

107 kg is heavy? You must be kidding. Anyway for you younger guys who are looking to get fit pushing your boats up and down the beach the Viper is several kg. heavier and if that's still not enough try strapping on some lead..

No, contacts are good and AHPC has always been fully supportive of the F16 class and F16 activities.

Such rumours have always been spread by a few well known individuals looking to find a fault line that may split the class when hammered hard.

Personally, I don't care one bit at what rating the Viper sails as long as it sails on elapsed time basis in official F16 events (and in possession of a compliant measurement certicate).

Additionally, the F16 class is fully supportive of AHPC and understands that they market the boat for multiple uses (among which both F16 and F104 for the French sailors)

Wouter

Additionally,

There is actually a good market for F16's and builders and agents involved don't really see the F18 and F16 classes as being competitors; rather they express the view that they see them as complementary.

I for one envision crews moving in and out of both classes and in eachother and I think that is actualle very healthy.

I too talk to various people and indeed sailors (also F18 crews) who test sail a F16 are almost invariably very positive afterwards.

There is ample market potential for both classes and in fact both can feed of eachother and be more successful.

Wouter

+1

"There is ample market potential for both classes and in fact both can feed of eachother and be more successful."

Then I guess the builder with both types in their product line is in good shape.