For those of you who missed it on SA:

http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=116434&pid=3084253&st=0&#top

Well, someone came up with macca's super-duper shiney carbon-everything and it's still 110Kg. Sure, it'll theoretically be stiffer than a 'standard' F16 but will it be quicker?

Do you reckon the cant on the boards is 6 deg or less? Only guessing but it looks like a fair bit. Sure that could be easily fixed. Not sure this particular boat has been built as an f16.

Hulls look great. So do the carbon beams.

Stiffer is better than lighter.

I would think this boat would dominate.

Till its on the water, raw specs are pretty useless.

After second look I could be wrong about the can't on the boards. Definitely looks pretty cool.

I very much doubt it'll dominate. The latest generation of F16s are pretty stiff already and the half-carbon Stealths are incredibly stiff too (and down to weight). Sure, this Bim will be no slouch, but it won't 'dominate'.

Ah the construction with the top panel removiable would sort of indicate that there could maybe see some rather large dagger board wells inserted, just maybe enough for adjustible cant or even better C boards AKA A class style. The rear hull shape would also indicate C boards are being thought about. But 110 kgs, why.

The username " lost in translation " has to sum up that statement.

On the topic of "Dominate", look at the A class, is there any one A cat design that dominates?

No.

Why?

Because once they have all hit the numbers, (max sail area, min wt. numbers) it comes down to the sailor's skill, as it should be.

So I don't think we will see any new design dominate the class, just like the A cats, since there are already several F16 designs out that already hit the numbers.

Bottom line; if you want to dominate, get a boat you like and sail the crap out of it. You can't buy skill, you have to get out and practice more if you want to go faster. A good skipper on a slow boat is always going to beat a poor skipper on a fast boat.

We haven't seen an F16 max out the available technology, or seen development all the way through either though.

Autoclaved, nomex cored everything, a few generations of hull design and some serious effort put into getting the mast and mainsail to work together might be a game changer. I think Matt has gone through quite a few re-cuts to get a sail to work properly with his carbon masts.

And yet, is he "Dominating" the class?

There are a few very good skipper's who dominate, no matter which boat they happen to be on that week (F18, F16, Acat) but there are no single boat designs that dominate any of those classes.

where are the beam bolts?

Well, it is not new for any developmet or formula class to see a design come out and take it to the next level.

The A Class took a leap in development from the Boyer boats to the Flyers. It now looks like there will be a simular leap from the the current boats to the DNA. Why has Ashby moved from the ASG3s which he builds to the DNA produced from a rival??? If one design makes a significant improvement in performance, then the other manufactures tend to update their designs.

F18

Tiger, then the Capricorn took it to a new level, Infusion refined some aspects of the Cap, then the C2 and WildCat came out further refining the Formula.

That's Formula / Development classes and the F16 class will not be immune from it. Weather this boat is the boat to take it to the next level, we can only wait and see, but at a quick glance it looks like it has the goods. Right now if I was looking at investing, then this boat would be the first I would look. I would love to see a min weigh pre preg nomex honeycome Viper.

And yes, the sailor will always make the biggest difference, but why put yourself on the back foot with a slower boat. Would Ashby win on a Mk 4 Boyer against Brewin on a DNA? Same applies to F16s.

Sorry the X16F is not class legal. Beams are glued on not bolted.

Apart from being slightly heavier than the Stealth which also has a fairly full compliment of Carbon accessories.. I cant see the Bim being a class killer.. I would also question if the Bim is in fact stiffer than the other platforms..

There is more to it than just all Carbon. Design plays a major roll as dose core material, lay up and curing technique. There are many Carbon A's on the market. The DNA is a different line of thinking re hull design, pre preg carbon nomex. The beams are also incorporated into the hulls, not just glued in.

I am sure you could order an X16F without the beams glued if desired (maybe extra $$$)

Development classes evolve. Even if current boats are all carbon they will be superseded by a faster design at some stage. If that bothers you, then don't play.

I don't think anyone that has posted here is indicating that they are at all bothered......

No, just a general comment not directed at anyone.

Do all agree though that faster designs will emerge, making older designs obsolete at the top level?

Only SMODS do not develop. Well not unless the SMOD builder decides to "evolve". That happens when they feel their bank balance needs a top up. Just ask the 49er boys about rig changes and other mods....

One designs develop.. Have a look at first few year 505 hull and a "modern" hull or in fact an original T vs a "Marstrom" T.....Ok not as much perhaps as an I14 or moth but their hulls change. So if you dont like development but like water sports.. Ummmmmmm try swimming Im assuming you don't include your own "evolution" of body drag form....

As for cores.. we can talk about history of cores if you wish.. Sailed a few times on "Jennifer Julian" and Colour7... But it all comes down to diminishing returns.. But tell me what was the core of Prime Computer? What was the standard core at that time?