| |  Re: US Sailing MHC: Alter Cup Survey Open Feb 15-20, 2012
[Re: Mark Schneider]
#244409
02/21/12 10:28 AM 02/21/12 10:28 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA David Ingram 
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA | I have no doubt that is true..
But Consider... how much it would cost in travel, per diem and hotel to pay the travel of a staffer to even attend and work the event! So... can't live with em... can't live without em.
I do not want to be in the position of defending USSA policy on these events, personnel, negotiating skills,competence etc .. I know there are problems and limitations...
When everybody thinks they are getting screwed over ... the solution is clarity in expectations, finances and philosophy.
This is the opportunity to sort that out.... or the volunteers won't be there to run ANY event. You are exactly right Mark, this particular staffer that we are talking about is not a valued asset but a liability so paying to have that resource there is counterproductive. Again, someone that could be easily replaced by volunteers and the championship would be better off for it, IMO. I'd also like to point out that Mr. Rejda got himself to Houston and LA on his own dime and "worked" the week. This is a volunteer who had to take time from is day job and again "paid" to be there!!!! The contrast between these two inviduals is crazy obvious, for one it's just a job, for the other it's a passion! Which one do you think served the championship better? Now your point regarding clarity of expectations. US Sailing made it crystal clear what the expectations were. The problem was it was a complete screw job! So I/we had go begging to US Sailing to please please work with us so we could make sure that we not only gave the sponsors fulfillment but the host and provider didn't get completely boned in the process. This is where I leaned heavily on the previous chairs to develop the best approach to resolve the situation. I guess US Sailing got tired of having to negotiate. Now if you do exactly what US Sailing wants and take exactly what's given and you’re grateful for it then things will be just peachy keen. Anything that goes outside those lines and you just might earn yourself a "Thank you for your service" letter.
David Ingram F18 USA 242 http://www.solarwind.solar"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda "Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall "You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
| | | Re: US Sailing MHC: Alter Cup Survey Open Feb 15-20, 2012
[Re: brucat]
#244410
02/21/12 10:39 AM 02/21/12 10:39 AM |
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 72
Rockledge Cay, FL Fearless_Rider
journeyman
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journeyman
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 72
Rockledge Cay, FL | We are US Sailing. Lower your sails and surrender your vessels. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile. ![[Linked Image]](http://www.bwafer.com/starwars/images/borgcube1.jpg)
Last edited by Fearless_Rider; 02/21/12 11:36 AM.
| | | Re: US Sailing MHC: Alter Cup Survey Open Feb 15-20, 2012
[Re: brucat]
#244411
02/21/12 10:52 AM 02/21/12 10:52 AM |
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,525 pgp
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,525
| Is that a pledge to challenge USS?
It turns out USS has quite a bit more money than I thought.
Last edited by pgp; 02/21/12 11:02 AM.
Pete Pollard
Blade 702
'When you have a lot of things to do, it's best to get your nap out of the way first.
| | | Re: US Sailing MHC: Alter Cup Survey Open Feb 15-20, 2012
[Re: David Ingram]
#244419
02/21/12 11:39 AM 02/21/12 11:39 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD Mark Schneider
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Annapolis, MD | Dave, I am sure those issues will re emerge when someone tries to put the championship back on line... It has worked out in the past.... all be it with a great deal of pain on both sides... I presume that it can work in the future..
I have no idea of the details... but i fully support the volunteers walking if the parties can't make it work. Said so at the MHC meeting if you remember.
Matt points out how few people participate in the debate... perhaps they think we are doing a fine job.. More likely they don't give a damn what happens... one way or the other. I think you design a championship that appeals to the elite sailors (max competition) and is open to the rank and file who BYOB.
What event would be unique (I agree with Merrick's point) and competitive enough to get the top sailors in the major One design fleets to spend time and money and compete?
I see it it as an open championship in something like double handed spinaker with charter boats available to the opposite coast sailors and NCAA champs and appropriate class champions.
Open to the USSA membership with a class legal boat or one with a measurement certificate. (Open handles the opportunity legal issues while regatta pricing takes into account the charter boat subsidies needed to make it work.
Everybody has their own boat... (this allows you to run a three day event with 10 races and not mess with equipment redress issues. (Much easier on a host club to run this kind of regatta.
Double handed spin (or sloop or single handed in alternate years) so that a measurement based handicap system can do a fair job rating similar boats.
If the new Mixed Multihull Class made this one of the domestic schedules big events.. And the One design classes promised to work to get their top sailors to the event (subsidize entry fee, provide a boat, ete etc ) I can see enough star power committed to the regatta to attract a lot of sailors willing to pay a premium to see how they measure up (laugh) (or get smoked).
Remember, Mixed multihull will probably have no more teams then the last few Tornado cycles had.... 3 to 5. Putting on a decent regatta will be problematic... Participating in a large open championship would be a good large fleet NA regatta for these sailors.
crac.sailregattas.com
| | | Re: US Sailing MHC: Alter Cup Survey Open Feb 15-20, 2012
[Re: Mark Schneider]
#244423
02/21/12 12:01 PM 02/21/12 12:01 PM |
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA David Ingram
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA | Dave, I am sure those issues will re emerge when someone tries to put the championship back on line... It has worked out in the past.... all be it with a great deal of pain on both sides... I presume that it can work in the future..
I have no idea of the details... but i fully support the volunteers walking if the parties can't make it work. Said so at the MHC meeting if you remember.
Matt points out how few people participate in the debate... perhaps they think we are doing a fine job.. More likely they don't give a damn what happens... one way or the other. I think you design a championship that appeals to the elite sailors (max competition) and is open to the rank and file who BYOB.
What event would be unique (I agree with Merrick's point) and competitive enough to get the top sailors in the major One design fleets to spend time and money and compete?
I see it it as an open championship in something like double handed spinaker with charter boats available to the opposite coast sailors and NCAA champs and appropriate class champions.
Open to the USSA membership with a class legal boat or one with a measurement certificate. (Open handles the opportunity legal issues while regatta pricing takes into account the charter boat subsidies needed to make it work.
Everybody has their own boat... (this allows you to run a three day event with 10 races and not mess with equipment redress issues. (Much easier on a host club to run this kind of regatta.
Double handed spin (or sloop or single handed in alternate years) so that a measurement based handicap system can do a fair job rating similar boats.
If the new Mixed Multihull Class made this one of the domestic schedules big events.. And the One design classes promised to work to get their top sailors to the event (subsidize entry fee, provide a boat, ete etc ) I can see enough star power committed to the regatta to attract a lot of sailors willing to pay a premium to see how they measure up (laugh) (or get smoked).
Remember, Mixed multihull will probably have no more teams then the last few Tornado cycles had.... 3 to 5. Putting on a decent regatta will be problematic... Participating in a large open championship would be a good large fleet NA regatta for these sailors.
And what would we need US Sailing for? They won't crack the tough nuts, they won't kick in any real $$, they will however happily take the $50 per person surcharge. So again what will US Sailing do for us? Nothing in Bob's proposal is a deal breaker if US Sailing is not involved. If US Sailing MUST be a player then I want to know what will we get for our $50 per person surcharge? The answer of paid staffers to keep train on the tracks is a red herring.
David Ingram F18 USA 242 http://www.solarwind.solar"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda "Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall "You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
| | | Re: US Sailing MHC: Alter Cup Survey Open Feb 15-20, 2012
[Re: brucat]
#244425
02/21/12 12:11 PM 02/21/12 12:11 PM |
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,525 pgp
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 5,525
| Any organization will divide and conquer. Unless you're willing to join with others, you'll get nowhere.
Pete Pollard
Blade 702
'When you have a lot of things to do, it's best to get your nap out of the way first.
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