| |  Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: TheManShed]
#247220
04/19/12 11:13 AM 04/19/12 11:13 AM |
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL waterbug_wpb 
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL | basic economics of supply and demand. That being said, I can't imagine the profit margins are substantial due to all of the reasons posted.
Who said Shiny-itis was cheap?
Jay
| | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: Karl_Brogger]
#247222
04/19/12 11:21 AM 04/19/12 11:21 AM |
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA David Ingram
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,906
Clermont, FL, USA |
I don't have anything against the F18, but the F18 crowd is just rabid about their love for that boat, and you guys are waaaaayyyy to f-ing sensitive. Anything short of showering the boat with praise is viewed negatively.
Fixed it
I don't have anything against the F16, but the F16 crowd is just rabid about their love for that boat, and you guys are waaaaayyyy to f-ing sensitive. Anything short of showering the boat with praise is viewed negatively.
Fixed it again.
I don't have anything against the A-cat, but the A-cat crowd is just rabid about their love for that boat, and you guys are waaaaayyyy to f-ing sensitive. Anything short of showering the boat with praise is viewed negatively.
I could keep going but I was getting bored.
David Ingram F18 USA 242 http://www.solarwind.solar"Do or do not. There is no try." - Yoda "Excuses are the tools of the weak and incompetent" - Two sista's I overheard in the hall "You don't have to be a brain surgeon to be a complete idiot, but it helps"
| | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: F-18 5150]
#247226
04/19/12 12:47 PM 04/19/12 12:47 PM |
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,119
Northfield Mn Karl_Brogger
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,119
Northfield Mn | You're probably right Dave. I'm not that way I don't think. I sail F16 because of a lack of other viable options. Nothing else fits the bill.
Had I won the mega millions a few weeks ago I'd have someone working on a 20' singlehander with a wing, a spinnaker, some sort of lifting board, and very little weight.
I'm boatless.
| | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: F18_VB]
#247229
04/19/12 01:05 PM 04/19/12 01:05 PM |
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,430
california F-18 5150 OP
veteran
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OP
veteran
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,430
california | I think the biggest thing that changed is that there is no longer the perception that the Tiger (a 10+ year old design) can win any regatta. The perception may or may not be based in reality. But, it means that sailors are willing to pay a premium for what they perceive as a faster boat.
Manufacturers are responding to this by updating their boats and selling costly upgrades like long daggerboards.
This perception may be based because a new design has won Worlds the past few years. So, hopefully the 2012 worlds is not won on a Cirrus R or a Falcon F18 (sorry Matt). My bet is a Cirrus R will win and it will probably be Orange. Maybe after the Worlds there will be some nice New/Used boats available. My understanding is there is at least one of the newer designed boats up for a new hulls to follow the Cirrus R in the fat and flat bottom. | | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: F-18 5150]
#247235
04/19/12 04:04 PM 04/19/12 04:04 PM |
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL waterbug_wpb
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,590
Naples, FL | +1
no amount of boat design will ever make up for my multiple blown tacks/gybes, overstanding the mark, bad starts and poor seamanship skill.
Jay
| | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: orphan]
#247253
04/20/12 05:52 AM 04/20/12 05:52 AM |
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 337
Victoria, Australia C2 Mike
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 337
Victoria, Australia | 10K for a Hobie 16 ain't cheap. What was the price of a hobie 16 in the mid 80's 1500-2000. Do you realize that used 80s and 90s hobies are selling for more then the cost new(20 years ago). But it is not just cats. Look at the laser(same boat higher price).
Oh FFS! Mid 80's was near 30 years ago! As CEO/General manager/President or whatever you call it in your part of the world of several businesses, one industry I wouldn't want to be in over the last 5 years is boat building. Save a few long established OD classes such as H16 it'd be a very hard gig. Let alone on a development class such as F18 where one month you have the fastest mousetrap only to be the trash next. For me, the cost of R&D is very much under estimated. The number of boats it's amortised over, even if you are on a winner is really quite low, especially when you take into account the ongoing costs such as sail and foil development over the lifetime of a hull. Of course it's not a total explanation of costs but the business of selling boats these days would be a hard gig IMO. Tiger(C2)Mike | | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: David Ingram]
#247254
04/20/12 06:01 AM 04/20/12 06:01 AM |
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 337
Victoria, Australia C2 Mike
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 337
Victoria, Australia |
I don't have anything against the F18, but the F18 crowd is just rabid about their love for that boat, and you guys are waaaaayyyy to f-ing sensitive. Anything short of showering the boat with praise is viewed negatively.
Fixed it
I don't have anything against the F16, but the F16 crowd is just rabid about their love for that boat, and you guys are waaaaayyyy to f-ing sensitive. Anything short of showering the boat with praise is viewed negatively.
Fixed it again.
I don't have anything against the A-cat, but the A-cat crowd is just rabid about their love for that boat, and you guys are waaaaayyyy to f-ing sensitive. Anything short of showering the boat with praise is viewed negatively.
I could keep going but I was getting bored. hahahaha funny but oh so true. Tiger(C2)Mike | | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: F-18 5150]
#247257
04/20/12 08:28 AM 04/20/12 08:28 AM |
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,049
Sebring, Florida. Timbo
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,049
Sebring, Florida. | Hey, for $7,000 less than a new F18, you can have one of these, and guess what? Even though it's 'slow', it's twice as fast as an F18! (the cat, not the jet) $13,000 ready to fly. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Lhz0JwxkQA So easy a 14yr. old boy just bought one! http://fly103.com/
Blade F16
#777
| | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: waterbug_wpb]
#247258
04/20/12 08:42 AM 04/20/12 08:42 AM |
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 678
Palm Beach County TheManShed
addict
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addict
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 678
Palm Beach County | +1
no amount of boat design will ever make up for my multiple blown tacks/gybes, overstanding the mark, bad starts and poor seamanship skill. Ha too funny but sadly enough true for many or by my XXL size. But you got to love it. All said and done the beauty and awesomeness of a F18, skippered by the best and touch of the luck, around the marks is spectacular. I remember thinking that about most new designs as they came out starting with the NACRA 5.2. I keep on saying they can’t push cat design much further and over the years I’m always surprised.
Mike Shappell www.themanshed.comTMS-20 Builder G-Cat 5.7 - Current Boat NACRA 5.2 - early 70's | | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: F-18 5150]
#247276
04/20/12 03:47 PM 04/20/12 03:47 PM |
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,049
Sebring, Florida. Timbo
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,049
Sebring, Florida. | All my copilots are chipping in to buy me one of those, such nice guys they all are!
Hey, Flying (or falling) won't kill you, it's the sudden stop that kills you! You notice they offer a parachute package for an additional $3,500!
Blade F16
#777
| | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: Timbo]
#247280
04/20/12 04:57 PM 04/20/12 04:57 PM |
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,582
“an island in the Pacifi... hobie1616
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,582
“an island in the Pacifi... | You notice they offer a parachute package for an additional $3,500! A friend has a Cirrus SR20X. The chute comes standard.
US Sail Level 2 Instructor
US Sail Level 3 Coach | | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: hobie1616]
#247281
04/20/12 05:05 PM 04/20/12 05:05 PM |
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,490
On the Water P.M.
Pooh-Bah
|
Pooh-Bah
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,490
On the Water | You notice they offer a parachute package for an additional $3,500! A friend has a Cirrus SR20X. The chute comes standard. My brother had the SR22. At $400,000 the chute should be standard equipment.
Philip
USA #1006
| | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: P.M.]
#247283
04/20/12 05:48 PM 04/20/12 05:48 PM |
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,582
“an island in the Pacifi... hobie1616
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,582
“an island in the Pacifi... | You notice they offer a parachute package for an additional $3,500! A friend has a Cirrus SR20X. The chute comes standard. My brother had the SR22. At $400,000 the chute should be standard equipment. At $400K they should come with a helium balloon that would gently deposit you back on Mother Earth. 
US Sail Level 2 Instructor
US Sail Level 3 Coach | | | Re: Why are F-18's so expensive?
[Re: P.M.]
#247313
04/21/12 10:02 PM 04/21/12 10:02 PM |
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,403 Ventucky Red
veteran
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veteran
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,403
| You notice they offer a parachute package for an additional $3,500! A friend has a Cirrus SR20X. The chute comes standard. My brother had the SR22. At $400,000 the chute should be standard equipment. $400K for a Cirrus SR22 - wowch!!! All my copilots are chipping in to buy me one of those, such nice guys they all are!
Hey, Flying (or falling) won't kill you, it's the sudden stop that kills you! You notice they offer a parachute package for an additional $3,500! Come on out to CMA... we have a flying circus of these things... I swear one of these days Bob Dylan's G5 is going to hit one
Last edited by Ventucky Red; 04/21/12 10:06 PM.
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