| |  Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: NacramanUK]
#270272
03/15/14 11:00 AM 03/15/14 11:00 AM |
Joined: Sep 2004
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+31NL Tony_F18 
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+31NL | | | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: NacramanUK]
#270275
03/15/14 04:19 PM 03/15/14 04:19 PM |
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Portland, Maine ThunderMuffin
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Portland, Maine | Yes thats the one.....full foils with angle of attack adjustment and cassette style T foils.......new hull position for the dagger board cases.....retro fitable kit of foils (including AoA adjuster system) , rudder system and dagger board cases (with fitting instructions) available for existing F20 C's......please pm me for European pricing.... How about for real money pricing? | | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: ThunderMuffin]
#270277
03/15/14 05:24 PM 03/15/14 05:24 PM |
Joined: Apr 2013
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Victoria Australia Pirate
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Victoria Australia | wise man once said.....
if you have to ask .... you can't afford it !
Yar, & this ere post be done without a sin'le drop o' rum passin' me lips
Kingy
started with Impara Cadet #3 / Mosquito #245
& now Mosquitos #1182 & #1740
| | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: Jake]
#270367
03/18/14 01:33 PM 03/18/14 01:33 PM |
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD Mark Schneider
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Annapolis, MD | got one of those gifs for VIDEOS!
So.. we have production 2 man 20 footer that flies. Nacra Carbon 20
We have a production 2 man 18 footer that flies. Flying Phantom
And we have production single handed A cats that will fly as well (class may or may not be so happy about that)
When do you hit critical mass in these flying fleets?
crac.sailregattas.com
| | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: Mark Schneider]
#270368
03/18/14 01:41 PM 03/18/14 01:41 PM |
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina Jake
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South Carolina | got one of those gifs for VIDEOS!
So.. we have production 2 man 20 footer that flies. Nacra Carbon 20
We have a production 2 man 18 footer that flies. Flying Phantom
And we have production single handed A cats that will fly as well (class may or may not be so happy about that)
When do you hit critical mass in these flying fleets? Yesterday...it's a fad.  Seriously, though...we'll probably eventually see it consolidate into one, ~maybe~ two classes. 20 footers have been out of style for a while - I'm betting on the 18 foot a-cat first and then some other kind of double handed class later.
Jake Kohl
| | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: Jake]
#270369
03/18/14 02:07 PM 03/18/14 02:07 PM |
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 98 NacramanUK OP
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| Pics/video Full foiling F20 Carbon FCS video This is the prototype without T foil rudders and without the new style dagger board cases in their new position.......Melvin and Morreli did all the numbers on new the position of the new style tapered cases ......
Last edited by NacramanUK; 03/19/14 03:16 AM.
| | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: NacramanUK]
#270370
03/18/14 02:10 PM 03/18/14 02:10 PM |
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina Jake
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South Carolina | Pics/video [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjVEOoNPXWc][/url] This is the prototype without T foil rudders and without the new style dagger board cases in their new position.......Melvin and Morreli did all the numbers on new the position of the new style tapered cases ...... So, "see the previous pictures. But they're totally different". I'm mostly jesting...it's not like 90% of us are in the market for anything like this but it would be nice to see how they're configuring the foiling technology.
Jake Kohl
| | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: Jake]
#270375
03/18/14 07:28 PM 03/18/14 07:28 PM |
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,116
Annapolis, MD Mark Schneider
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Annapolis, MD | Yesterday...it's a fad. wink
Never gets old... Still the old man was right! The single handed spin class never took off (F16 or NF17)
Seriously, though...we'll probably eventually see it consolidate into one, ~maybe~ two classes. 20 footers have been out of style for a while - I'm betting on the 18 foot a-cat first and then some other kind of double handed class later.Well, If you look at the moth experience... they have 5 events on the schedule in 4 venues.... It is pretty much a national class. So... I agree.... you might get a national class of flying A class first. Of course Nacra could fix the N17 for the next quad with their new foils and t foil rudders.... and grow the N17 class beyond Olympic sailors. You will never convince me that the current boat is well behaved.. flying N17 https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...83.1073742013.100000032863762&type=1
Last edited by Mark Schneider; 03/18/14 07:29 PM.
crac.sailregattas.com
| | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: bacho]
#270389
03/19/14 11:00 AM 03/19/14 11:00 AM |
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 98 NacramanUK OP
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| The European price I got on the retro fit kit was €7,445 ex tax/shipping. An exciting offering but certainly not cheap!
The new FCS at €31,250 is €2773 (before tax/shipping) more than the race package equipped F20c.
Sounds to me that it's hard to justify the kit on a used boat as it would be just over $10k before any installation labor. The kit does sound very interesting, I would love to see some pictures.
The flying phantom is €28,260 for comparison.
Please remember although the F20Carbon FCS is Euro 2,990 more than the Flying Phantom the F20 FCS hulls are 12.3% longer (6.2m), its beam width is 6.6% wider (3.2m), its mast is 8.8% longer (10.45m), the main sail area is 16% larger (21m2) and the spinnaker sail area is 16% larger (28m2). So you do get a lot more boat for your money! | | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: NacramanUK]
#270392
03/19/14 11:37 AM 03/19/14 11:37 AM |
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 932
Solomon's Island, MD samc99us
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Solomon's Island, MD | Plus a little more local support, for whatever that is worth in Nacra $$ these days. IMO, at this stage of the game, if you have to ask what it costs you don't have the capital required for WHEN the foils break. The other route to take is do the design work and build work yourself; how much is your time worth and are you as good as M&M at design work?
How many non-flying F20c's are there? How many Phantoms are there in the U.S in the road-legal stock F-18 version? Remember, both of these boats are 10' wide and carbon prices aren't going down. The only classes you'll be racing in full flying this decade are the Moth and A-cat, otherwise it's a line-honors machine.
There is also a lot more going on in Europe than Nacraman is letting on in this thread....Mark have any leads on a good used Marstrom T w/ modern carbon rig?
Last edited by samc99us; 03/19/14 11:40 AM.
Scorpion F18
| | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: samc99us]
#270393
03/19/14 11:48 AM 03/19/14 11:48 AM |
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 98 NacramanUK OP
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| Plus a little more local support, for whatever that is worth in Nacra $$ these days. IMO, at this stage of the game, if you have to ask what it costs you don't have the capital required for WHEN the foils break. The other route to take is do the design work and build work yourself; how much is your time worth and are you as good as M&M at design work?
How many non-flying F20c's are there? How many Phantoms are there in the U.S in the road-legal stock F-18 version? Remember, both of these boats are 10' wide and carbon prices aren't going down. The only classes you'll be racing in full flying this decade are the Moth and A-cat, otherwise it's a line-honors machine.
There is also a lot more going on in Europe than Nacraman is letting on in this thread....Mark have any leads on a good used Marstrom T w/ modern carbon rig? Hehehe sam........ | | | Re: Full foiling Nacra F20 FCS
[Re: NacramanUK]
#270394
03/19/14 11:51 AM 03/19/14 11:51 AM |
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 98 NacramanUK OP
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| Plus a little more local support, for whatever that is worth in Nacra $$ these days. IMO, at this stage of the game, if you have to ask what it costs you don't have the capital required for WHEN the foils break. The other route to take is do the design work and build work yourself; how much is your time worth and are you as good as M&M at design work?
How many non-flying F20c's are there? How many Phantoms are there in the U.S in the road-legal stock F-18 version? Remember, both of these boats are 10' wide and carbon prices aren't going down. The only classes you'll be racing in full flying this decade are the Moth and A-cat, otherwise it's a line-honors machine.
There is also a lot more going on in Europe than Nacraman is letting on in this thread....Mark have any leads on a good used Marstrom T w/ modern carbon rig? Hehehe sam........ Just to clarify standard F18 Phantoms are 8'6" wide, Flying Phantoms are 10' wide, F20 Carbon and F20 Carbon FCS are 10' 6" wide...... | | |
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