its on my list of must do that
just haven't gotten around to it as yet..... I even had the cash in my pocket at the states but completely forgot all about it...

Gary.....
I'd send you a PM but ...... thricebitten is over their Private Topic limit

Hi Kingy,

WOW I had no idea all that history was there, made me feel old going back to delete it all.

Plenty of space for PM's now, but if it's about VMCA you can allways contact me through the racingcat.com website, go to vmca.

Bite the bullet man, it's only $25!

Do you think any of those other Western District Mossie sailors would come to the State Titles if there was a Division for old boats?

I'll put out a challenge to you Western Victorians... I will come to next year's Vic States if you come too. It's a lot further for me (Grafton NSW) than you.

PM sent

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Yeah yeah yeah..... I'm getting onto it ..... (still flat-out building Rome )


I went to the state's but sadly only as a spectator although I did at the time have every intention of sailing.
I hope to get around to a lot more events during the coming season so the states are on the list to do only as a COMPETITOR (probably not much of one but I don't quit that easily)


As for the classic's class, I think there's a possibility we could attract older boats to the tittles with the right combination of incentives and "fair sailing" when it comes to the actual racing..... I've touched on that before where the older girls need a 'head-start' and the skinny boats can play catch-up

no-one wants to finish last even if their gear or ability places them there, you'll soon loose people if they aren't in a group as such so a fairer system needs to be 'designed' so we can all have company throughout the entire race and we can all finish within a leg of each other, not easy to do but not impossible either



Back in my youth, the local club had a great handicapper and racing was always close in the points department, twice a year we had a stern chaser which 'tested' the handicap, there was even a set of scales for boat weight and crew weight and that was worked into the handicap system as part of the formula for racing.....
Our stern chasers were always damn close, I remember one in which every boat ( ~20 odd ) finished within a 2minute time frame of each other, the field was a cross section of a brand new A-class to a Hartley Traler sailor with 3 very big blokes and probably the same number of boxes of Melbourne Bitter long necks


it can be done...... I just don't know how to do it !!!

I dont really know the answer, but rather than...by the way..such and such was the first heavyweight boat, but possibly a complete seperate divison for +65kg boats, cat and sloop?

Only an idea, I'm not committing to either the Taipan or Mosquito States at this stage.

Where are the Mosquito States by the way?

for me the 65+ class sounds appealing, especially as a seperate series all together. (for my moz might need a bit more). The biggest issue i find with mine is getting speed off the wind, so if anyone has ideas on how to fix that im up for it. compete pretty well with most upwind,

So, has the committee got any ideas on this? If you want the heavyweight Mosquitos to pay a membership and attend State Titles then maybe needs a closer a look at..

These boats are just going to stay at their clubs, not travel, and not join the association unless something is bought to the table in my opinion.

What needs to be remembered is at the time these boats were built as close to minimum as they could at the time, given the materials available at the time. The minimum weight in the meantime has dropped, which is understandable, but in terms of being competitive these boats are hamstrung.

I realise its not all about winning, its social, its racing, its a holiday or time away for some, its a learning tool for those new to class. But, I honestly believe if your going to make the effort, then it would nice to know the opportunity would be there to be competitive within reason.

I realise a seperate division or divisions would of course be dependent on numbers, but the idea is there..

None of the above is a critism, or rant, its just an idea and its one that I think is worth looking into, or maybe theres a better idea out there somewhere?

There is a thread somewhere about this topic. We did have a 65+ section but over the years the number of the old boats have dropped off, or sold for upgrade to new boats. And it came down to only one boat then none, so we got rid of it all together. If we have 6 or more boats interested, then the committee might do something about it, if enough interest!

Thanks Matt, thats a good start I believe anyway.

The point of difference before, was the 65+ division wasn't really a division, an award of some description was given to the first heavyweight boat in the series. I think...stand to be corrected on that one, but thats how I remember it.

if you build it they will come



Clearly there are plenty of old girls out there, and for the most part some of them are still being actively sailed at club level with a few of us that are game enough to venture off to local regattas.
8 or 9 mozzies showed up at the Easter regatta held at Lake Bolac, the 'fastest mozzie' of the group spent most of the w/end parked on the beach while the heavyweights flogged it out.....

"Shy" has shown that even a over-weight fugly-duckling can bring home the trophies and I have to admit I've had a ball sailing her to her max and pushing her harder every time I've 'fixed' her up a bit better so much fun for a dollar outlay that cant be beaten.

With constant numbers of Mozzies going through eBay & Gum-Tree etc, its obvious to me atleast that people either cant afford the wiz-bang carbon setup or don't want to go there because of the ongoing costs or upgrades to stay competitive at the top level, yet these old girls give a VERY affordable bang for buck sailing FUN and a lot of people know this and that's why we see them being sold whilst other classes struggle to sell.

A series for boats in a weighted division ...... where does this proud sailor of a classic mosquito sign

Yep

Its not up to the committee to build it for them to come.

If you want it to happen its up to the owners of these boats to try and make it work.

Finding all these boats and contacting the owners will be the challenge, I think finding 6 sloops would be achievable, I can think of a handful straight off the bat.

My point was that you can get into a vicious cycle of sorts in these situations. The association/committee is waiting for entrants/membership and the boat owners are waiting to see what they get for said entry/membership ...

This is what we have associations for ... to take the first step and/or try again after trying before.

For what it's worth, I would suggest a +65 division (but don't call it that) that is part of the usual events. If boats are slightly under 65kg they can choose to add some weight and enter into that division. If not enough boats just sail a combined fleet. Would be fun to see if some of the 'best' +65kg boats could beat the 'under 65kg' boats around the course ... that would add some interest!

Perhaps +65kg boats could be eligible for both classes?

(If there were more '+65' boats around, perhaps us Cobras would be able to keep up!)




[... just in case people are wondering ... I am a member of the VIC Cobra Association and have sailed in every National and State Championships except one since I purchased my boat in 2008. I am a passionate advocate for class association membership and regatta participation.]

65+ is just a number, and it sounds better than heavyweight in my opinion. Most of the boats I'm refering to are probably more like 75-80kg in reality.

65+ is roughly half way between minimum class weight and the average weight of the heavier boats. Actually if it were 70+ I don't any of the era boats I'm referring to would be eliminated or forced in the lighter division. If I had to take a wild stab in the dark, I would say most boats pre sail number 1200-1300 would be a heavyweight.

Oh, and I paid a membership last night too.

Good on you for joining the Association.

I agree with you that 65kg is probably too low. I would be in favor of 70+ or maybe even higher.

The reason why I suggest 65+ is not the best name is because it is not immediately obvious what it refers to. Age of boat (pre 1965)? Age of skipper? You are trying to attract new/inexperienced sailors and many of them may not actually know how much their boat actually weighs, or should weigh. They just like sailing ...

simple solution.....


Classic class

Most forms of motorsport actively encourage older cars into the fray, classes such as, vintage, veteran, classic, and post classic, motorcycle racing also actively supports these types of classes and have even more 'classes' for your bike to fit within the guidelines, they even go as far to have classes that strictly limit the value of the bikes, the Bucket Rcing class does NOT allow bikes to be bought OR sold for any more the $500 and the bike MUST be for sale 24/7 / 365 days a year...... but you can spend as much as you like on it....
So if your racing one of these bikes and I think its better than mine I simply buy it and race it, if you refuse to sell it then the bike is instantly illegible to EVER race again in the class !!! (at one meeting many years ago I owned 3 different bikes in one day)

remember......

it may only be a name but it should reflect the boats without being negative

Just to clarify a few points.

There has always (for 15 years at least) been a box to tick on entry forms for states and national titles for boats over 65kg. There are separate prizes for the heavier boats and they can also win overall (and sometimes have done).

The heavyweight prizes were actively raced for but the numbers of boats over 65kg has continued to drop to the point where there is only one or less turning up. In that case no prize is awarded.

The minimum weight of the boats hasn't changed, only the method of weighing (and even that was 25 years ago). The heavy boats are heavy because they were built that way or have absorbed water, been repaired and got heavy over the years.

What was the method of weighing previuosly please Tim?