With one or two exceptions, story seems to be similar in other high-performance classes. Doesn't look to me like this is a multihull issue. I think its an overall gap in performance small-boat sailing culture in the US.

There need to be some fundamental changes if we can't even qualify the country. One of them needs to be continuing, if not increasing, support for the disciplines and teams that don't make the cut. There needs to be a longer term vision to improve the pipeline. At the Olympics meeting during the US Sailing meeting in WI, I asked that question and was assured that was the idea. Time will tell...

Just for fun (and practice understanding the rules), let's pretend this regatta was the qualifier. What countries would now be qualified (and why)?

Mike

There is no mystery behind the problem. In countries like AUS, NZ and GBR at around 18 identified top sailors are funnelled into Olympic classes. Even if they haven't been identified due to being from a smaller club they tend to move towards high performance classes cause as a kid fast is fun. In the US these same sailors are moved onto club 470s and the like and spend the next four years practising ways to slow each other down.

Bingo - that and the giant sucking sound from the money sports.

Every country has its money sports and with the exception of France sailing isn't usually one of them.

Sorry - I'm a bit over-sensitive on the money-sport issue which in my opinion is a bit overblown here in the US. Seems we've sometimes got some effed up priorities.

As a bit of explanation, my son (16yrs old) is a reasonably good high school gymnast - recently finished 4th nationally in one of his events (mid-30's overall), but sadly that's probably not going to be good enough to take it to the next level. You see, from close to 300 college-level mens gymnastics programs in the late 1960's, there are now only 17 scholarship programs left in the US. This is due to a combination of Title IX (basically equal scholarship opportunity for women) which is/was the result of dominance of Football, Basketball, Baseball - aka money sports. The end result is the cutting or "defunding" of many mens minor sports programs over the last several decades. Therefore, if a student is a talented athlete and wants a chance at a scholarship to pay for University (and avoid huge debt), they go for the money sports where there are 1000's of scholarships available. I'd wager the same phenomenon has sucked the oxygen from the air for sailing as well.

Even at the high school level, schools typically don't offer gymnastics which means we pay for it at the club level - significant expense relative to the tax funded traditional sports.

Fortunately for my son, he does it because he loves it and we can thankfully afford to save enough money for a good portion of his secondary education. But, gymnastics may not be a part of that - perhaps one less candidate on the path to the Olympics...

I am certain this story has been repeated 100's of times for many talented young sailors out there too.

See that is where Australia is different. There is basically no such thing as a sports scholarship here and if you chase the money sports you basically skip uni to do it.

In the US, college sailors are not ALLOWED to collect money for anything related to sailing. Bizarre...

Mike

Interesting point re college..Dean Brenner, Olympic director up through London and his position was... Olympic talent is Olympic talent... you can take a college all american....coach em up in a high performance boat and be competitive in 4 and win medals in 8 years.... His evidence... Johnny and Charlie...
After the Wehyouth debacle no cats)... Josh Adams is the new Olympic director and he is implementing the youth and olympic development program (that Mike L noted). Presumably the college crowd wasted time in C420s with no spins!
Scarecrow sums it up... they spent 4 years learning how to make others go slow...


So... is the talent wasting their time in college sailing? Can they do both... train in high perormance and complete a degree? Can they do all three... Sail for a college program, train in high performance and get a degree?
What is the college experience for the N17 fleet? Presumably the college crowd wasted time in C420s with no spins! But... did they race something else high performance during that time?

I don't know all of the teams... so help out here.


Robbie Daniel / Sarah Streater
Old Fart... No College / Currently in college ... finding time and money for both c420s and n17s.

Mike Easton/ Kattie Pettibone
College / College

Mark Mendelbrat / His Wife
Old Fart & Olympic sailor / ??

JC/ Kristin Lane
??/??

Sarah Newberry/Matt Whitehead
??/??

Jeremy Wilmot/Chafee
??/??

Troll ??/Louisa ??
??/??

Stephanie/Tripp Burd
??/College

Sandra Taraligno / ?
Old Fart /

Now you've done it Mark, Sandra is going to Kick your butt!

College sailing is fantastic fun and some of the skills certainly transfer to performance boats. That said, college sailing alone won't get you there. I think if a sailor has olympic aspirations they need to have a frank conversation with their college coach about personal goals, team goals, and how the two can become mutual goals. That conversation is on the athlete to initiate and the coach to accommodate. I consider Ravi one of the best young talents we have, and he has a nice blog about his sailing (cats and college at BU) here: http://rpsailing.blogspot.com/

Robbie Daniel / Sarah Streater
Old Fart... No College / ODU Currently in college ... finding time and money for both c420s and n17s.

Mike Easton/ Kattie Pettibone
Tufts / College

Mark Mendelbrat / His Wife
Old Fart & Olympic sailor / ??

JC/ Kristin Lane
??/??

Sarah Newberry/Matt Whitehead
New College (not sure if she sailed)/ USF (not on sailing team as far as I know)

Jeremy Wilmot/Chafee
St. Mary's/Brown

Troll ??/Louisa ?? (Jeremy Wilmot is Troll)
??/??

Stephanie/Tripp Burd
ODU/Tulane

Sandra Taraligno / Tyler Burd
Old Fart /

David Hein / Jessica Claflin
online high school / Brown

Thanks Jeff

Any idea of When did most of the fleet started training in a high performance boat?

It looks like most of the fleet are following the traditional USA path of Lovell and Ogeltree... eg 4 year college career and then train up for a High performance boat.

Newberry, Whithead and Hein look like they are the only ones tracking like the Aussies or Brits.

Not really sure of everyone's background. I will say that having a background in a performance boat as a youth is valuable even if that boat isn't a cat.

My F18 skipper did the El Toro, 420, 29er progression on the West Coast. After sailing the 29er at a high level, jumping on an F18 was a pretty simple progression, especially because the boat handling on a cat is relatively easy. I know it has taken me a lot longer to get comfortable with apparent wind tactics and the high speed "playbook" since I took a mostly keelboat and slower dinghy route.

I actually think the 29er may be a better training boat for youth than a small cat in some cases, especially because they are easier to handle, easier to store, take up less space, and likely cheaper.

Jeff, Great observations.. I think Adams would agree with you that any high performance training in the junior pathway is becoming essential. Adams and US Sailing has taken that program step by cutting the number of 420 slots to ZERO and requiring i420 or 29ner or F16s for the two person boats in the youth pathway (youth champs).

The problem with the 29ner is that it needs some breeze and only the west coast can deliver breeze during the junior sailing periods in the summers. All of the high performance boats suffer... since without numbers... kids are not turned on by a solitary two boat training regime either. Something to ask Spina/Feeney/Adams.

Its a long road back to international success!

yes, but there is pole/mast dancing...


And I believe JC wend to UCF in Orlando? Started out on MC-scows too if memory serves..

He did not go to UCF, but another school in Orlando.

And he's a good friend of mine who is literally working every ounce of his body to compete and succeed.

And reading this thread is painful for its conjecture and speculation.

I don't think anyone on this thread doubts the commitment of those trying for the Olympics. It takes a substantial effort to even consider a campaign.

The reality is, however, that we are way behind the top Nacra 17 teams. I don't think anyone would argue that, especially the sailors. The question is what can we do as a community to ensure our teams have every chance to succeed in the near and long terms.

+1 From my time sailing with him, he's definitely a stand-up dude.

I would suspect $$$ being the top "what can we do" answer. With enough funding, these teams could focus exclusively on development (not fundraising, logistics, etc).

I think the steps now being taken to (a) identify potential talent and (b) sparking interest in the long road to the olympics are a good start.


On the other hand, if we used a different sport as an example... what does an Olympic medal in basketball offer to a potential star in that sport? Would they have a better prospect in a professional career with an Olympic medal around their neck?

Would an Olympic medal provide JC or Matt a better shot at a professional sailing job? Or would there be a more effective means to the top spots on an AC team (or VOR, or BWR, etc. etc.)?


And which would be your preference, to win a top world ranking or an Olympic medal?

Well said...If you know anyone on a campaign... you deeply respect their hard work... US Sailing has really stepped up funding and training. This upcoming gold cup event will award funding for two teams going into year three... It is tough to win the US slot and even tougher to succeed on the international level.