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Re: Compare the pictures above with this [Re: Wouter] #54116
08/28/05 02:47 AM
08/28/05 02:47 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline

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Rolf_Nilsen  Offline

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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
To me it looks more like he is doing his best to stay on the boat, or he have just jumped aboard.. Why is he on your boat barefoot?

You, on the other hand, seriously need to work on your "war face" (joke).

Chosing between Christa and this lad should be a no brainer..


Nice pictures Wouter, the whole set!

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Re: Compare the pictures above with this [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #54117
08/28/05 04:21 AM
08/28/05 04:21 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline OP
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Wouter  Offline OP
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe

Rolf,


Quote

To me it looks more like he is doing his best to stay on the boat, or he have just jumped aboard.



It may be the case that I did very much accellerate away there. In the surf speed is everything and I really do need to tell any crew that they really need to be quick about it. As my boat will just bolt away as soon as the sails have attached flow. Especially when no-one is on it. (or just one man)


Quote

Why is he on your boat barefoot?


He likes to sail that way

Quote

You, on the other hand, seriously need to work on your "war face" (joke).



Yeah I didn't have any time to paint my face with more agressive motives.


Quote

Chosing between Christa and this lad should be a no brainer..



Okay guys, the lady is starting to blush and feel uncomfortable now !

So quit droling over the pics will you !

Wouter


Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
Re: Compare the pictures above with this [Re: Wouter] #54118
08/28/05 10:31 AM
08/28/05 10:31 AM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,718
St Petersburg FL
Robi Offline
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Robi  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,718
St Petersburg FL
Quote
Okay guys, the lady is starting to blush and feel uncomfortable now !

So quit droling over the pics will you !

Wouter
NEVAR!!!!

Re: Compare the pictures above with this [Re: Robi] #54119
08/29/05 07:06 AM
08/29/05 07:06 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Tony_F18  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Wouter:
What is up with that purple "thing" you are wearing? Whatever it is, it makes your trapeze harness look like a big diaper .
And why dont you and your crew wear any gloves?

BTW, I saw a Taipan 4.9 at a short long-distance race last weekend (#186???). It was interesting to see how the FX1 compared to the 4.9. With Force 4 winds they where probably advantaged by sailing two-up, having a jib, and maybe having some more experience.
They finished 12th, I finished 16th (Out of 38).
Not to big a difference to upgrade I guess

Re: Compare the pictures above with this [Re: Tony_F18] #54120
08/29/05 08:29 AM
08/29/05 08:29 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline OP
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Wouter  Offline OP
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe

Quote

What is up with that purple "thing" you are wearing?


It is a spray overall. The top 1/3 is green and the botton 2/3 is purple. I used to have a green bouyancy aid with that both that one died some time ago. The stuff I'm wearing is old. The wetsuit, which you can't see, is from later 1970's and the Trapeze harness (diaper) is of about 1975.


Quote

Whatever it is, it makes your trapeze harness look like a big diaper .



Yep, I've heard similar comments before. This is however still the best harness I ever wore, with the possible exception of long distance races. Here I use my magic marine harness with inproved back support.

Laugh all you want, I'm not going to change harnesses. The oldy I'm wearing is called "a Tony" after its maker. A elite group of sailor will know immediately what is meant by a "Tony". I think the guy stopped making these over 20 years ago.


Quote

And why dont you and your crew wear any gloves?


I can only speak for myself. I forget to put them on in the hurry to get to that start line.


Quote

BTW, I saw a Taipan 4.9 at a short long-distance race last weekend (#186???).



That was Geert Ruesink and his crew Raymond.


Quote

It was interesting to see how the FX1 compared to the 4.9.


Rumour has it that the Taipan was second around the top mark !

Were you sailing singlehanded, with spi ?


Quote

With Force 4 winds they where probably advantaged by sailing two-up, having a jib, and maybe having some more experience.



Yeah and those extra 80 kg of weight (crew) on board was an advantage as well. This sounds alot like the typical arguments to explain why some other crew wasn't doing better.


Quote

They finished 12th, I finished 16th (Out of 38).



Sounds like a good result. Do you have a link to the full results ?

I assume these are the handicapped results and not the elapsed time listing ?

Will be interesting to look at the elapsed times.


Quote

Not to big a difference to upgrade I guess


Are you basing that conclusion upon the HANDICAPPED results listing ? I mean the whole point of handicapping is to take out the inequalities between boats. Under the assumption of comparable skills you will have to end up next to one-another on the listing even though one design of the two may be way faster then the other.

Unless I'm mistaken and you were giving elapsed time placings (no handicap corrections)


Are you going to Jazz and Sail ?

Wouter








Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
What about this [Re: Wouter] #54121
08/29/05 10:19 AM
08/29/05 10:19 AM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 86
Netherlands
sjon Offline
journeyman
sjon  Offline
journeyman

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 86
Netherlands
Hagara/Steinacher sailed in their pyjamas, wore a genuine TONY and became Olympic Champion on the tornado !!!
See picture.

Attached Files
56535-tornado.JPG (166 downloads)
Re: What about this 2 [Re: sjon] #54122
08/29/05 10:33 AM
08/29/05 10:33 AM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 86
Netherlands
sjon Offline
journeyman
sjon  Offline
journeyman

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 86
Netherlands
They not only use a Tony girdle but combine that with net stockings: a winning combination I would say.

Attached Files
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Re: What about this 3 [Re: sjon] #54123
08/29/05 10:40 AM
08/29/05 10:40 AM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 86
Netherlands
sjon Offline
journeyman
sjon  Offline
journeyman

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 86
Netherlands
From this side it certainly lookes like (well-filled) diapers

Attached Files
56537-hagara.JPG (183 downloads)
Re: Compare the pictures above with this [Re: Wouter] #54124
08/30/05 04:44 PM
08/30/05 04:44 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,584
+31NL
Tony_F18 Offline
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Tony_F18  Offline
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Quote
Were you sailing singlehanded, with spi ?

Yes, uni and spi...


Quote
Yeah and those extra 80 kg of weight (crew) on board was an advantage as well. This sounds alot like the typical arguments to explain why some other crew wasn't doing better.

The T4.9 is about 50kgs lighter than the FX1, so the overall weight with crew and all is probably about the same. Its just that with crew you can push a little bit harder, especially with the kite up when you can point higher.



Quote
Sounds like a good result. Do you have a link to the full results ?

I'll PM you with my email adres, reply to that and I'll send you the full results. (Excel file).


Quote
I assume these are the handicapped results and not the elapsed time listing ?

Yes, handicapped.


Quote
Are you going to Jazz and Sail ?

Nope, we're running our own cat regatta here in Medemblik. But will you goto Pampus? The current entries say there's gonna be a Mystere F16 competing...

Cya,

Re: Compare the pictures above with this [Re: Tony_F18] #54125
08/31/05 02:50 AM
08/31/05 02:50 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe
Wouter Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel
Wouter  Offline OP
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 9,582
North-West Europe

Quote

The T4.9 is about 50kgs lighter than the FX1, so the overall weight with crew and all is probably about the same.


I figure that you were sailing at 230 kg and Geert/Raymond were sailing at 265 kg. Not really the same but also not enough to cause to big inequalities. Afterall you said that it was blowing force 4 (13 - 15 knots) and then weight differences are not too important.

Quote

Its just that with crew you can push a little bit harder, especially with the kite up when you can point higher.



Well personally, in force 4 winds, I wouldn't overrate these things. Especially not on the 2 mtr deep lakes you were sailing. I would expect a singlehanded uni-rig with spi to do rather well here. At least according to my own experience sailing solo in such conditions. Of course by the same reasoning as you give, you yourself will have an advantage by pointing higher upwind and pointing deeper downwind under kite.

Are there inequalities ? Yes I think so, however I also feel that most will cancel one another out when taken over a whole upwind/downwind course. Similar experiences seem to have surfaced at the UK nationals as well. But of course this is all a personal intepretation of the situation and without in depth 1 to 1 testing between F16 and FX-one we won't know for sure.



And having said all this. The rating difference between a two-up F16 and an singlehanded FX-one is (102 to 107) = 5 points = 5 % in time. This in itself is not very big; only 3 minutes per hour racing. Hence we invite FX-one's etc to race first in wins with us and always have done so as sailor skill can overcome this difference relatively easy.

The final placings suggest that you finished a little later than 5% but not too much later. So yes the Texel handicap appears to be validated when going on this Rondje Fluessen race data. No real surprises there. You said :"not enough to upgrade" and I can understand that. It isn't. But when deciding between a F16 and FX-one, when you haven't either one already, then this difference will be sufficient grounds to favour the first.

Actually I think this comparison to be very good fun. Especially since the sailarea's between FX-one and F16 are the same. So too the mast height and the width is only different by 4 % = neglectable. Even the hull length difference is not that big ; waterlength difference = 0.23 mtr (10 inches) = 4.6 %. Real diffences are only the overall weight, the mast section and the hullshapes (when comparing the older Taipan to the new wave-piercer hull of the FX-one).

It will be even more fun to directly compare the Blade F16 and FX-one to one another. Because they share the same modern hullshape leaving only the mast section and overall weight as differences. Even the shape of the mainsails (large squaretops will be very similar then)

But I guess we still have to wait a little while for that.


Quote

Nope, we're running our own cat regatta here in Medemblik. But will you goto Pampus? The current entries say there's gonna be a Mystere F16 competing...



Darn, for some reason we always seem to miss eachother.

Pampus ? That is under consideration, but very much tentative at this time.

Mystere F16 ? Gee, I haven't seen that boat in real life for about 4 years.


Wouter




Wouter Hijink
Formula 16 NED 243 (one-off; homebuild)
The Netherlands
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