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Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: hobie1616] #72727
04/20/06 05:36 PM
04/20/06 05:36 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 471
NC
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drbinkle Offline
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NC
That pretty much sums up the excitement from mark roundings all 3 days.

-- Have You Seen This? --
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: hobie1616] #72728
04/21/06 11:32 AM
04/21/06 11:32 AM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 302
Raleigh/ Wrightsville Beach NC
MarkW_F18 Offline
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Raleigh/ Wrightsville Beach NC
The amazing thing is that he saved that pitchpole (photos 248-260). I've got to get some shoes that stick like that. I just wonder how his crew got back on the boat to finish the race.

I was not as lucky (photos 277-288) Even after studing those photos, I still can't beleive the hulls dug as quick as they did. We had overstood the mark and were reaching down to it, but I had my traveler way out and was dumping the main when I was coming off the wire.
I've sailed H20s for 12 years and I'm use to bearing off in high winds with a overpowered main. It just happened so quick. I'm sticking to my story of microburst gust.


Mark Williams
F18 H16
http://emsa-sailing.org
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: MarkW_F18] #72729
04/21/06 11:34 AM
04/21/06 11:34 AM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 302
Raleigh/ Wrightsville Beach NC
MarkW_F18 Offline
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Raleigh/ Wrightsville Beach NC
Well, I'm playing golf this weekend.... Hope I don't trip over my golf shoes.
Have a good weekend


Mark Williams
F18 H16
http://emsa-sailing.org
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: MarkW_F18] #72730
04/21/06 11:57 AM
04/21/06 11:57 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,121
Eastern NC, USA
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tshan Offline
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Quote
I had my traveler way out and was dumping the main when I was coming off the wire.


Would anything have been different if the traveler stayed centered (or almost centered) and the main was dumped? I've always been taught that creating that "twist" is going to depower on a reach more effectively. Going on memory, the NF18 that saved the pictchpole looked to have the car centered or almost centered. Also notice the force of the mast moving forward on the NAF18 sequence and creating a very loose forestay (jib is bagged up). I've known that this happens, but have not seen such a dramatic capture of the effect of pitchpoling on the jib.

Obviously, no amount of depowering helps in certain wind ranges.


Tom
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: tshan] #72731
04/21/06 12:29 PM
04/21/06 12:29 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Jake  Offline
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Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Quote
Quote
I had my traveler way out and was dumping the main when I was coming off the wire.


Would anything have been different if the traveler stayed centered (or almost centered) and the main was dumped? I've always been taught that creating that "twist" is going to depower on a reach more effectively. Going on memory, the NF18 that saved the pictchpole looked to have the car centered or almost centered. Also notice the force of the mast moving forward on the NAF18 sequence and creating a very loose forestay (jib is bagged up). I've known that this happens, but have not seen such a dramatic capture of the effect of pitchpoling on the jib.

Obviously, no amount of depowering helps in certain wind ranges.


His luff was just loose on the jib - look at a few pictures before the pitchpole.


Jake Kohl
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Jake] #72732
04/22/06 10:21 AM
04/22/06 10:21 AM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 736
Westport, Ma. U.S.A.
Brian_Mc Offline
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Brian_Mc  Offline
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Westport, Ma. U.S.A.
Guys, I just got a new PC, but can't seem to get to Walter Cooper's photos. I clicked on "Recent Events", but then the list of events didn't link to anything. What am I doing wrong? Thanks!

Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Brian_Mc] #72733
04/22/06 10:27 AM
04/22/06 10:27 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Jake Offline
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Jake  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,310
South Carolina
Go to "print sales"...not sure if this link will take you straight there because you have to agree to terms....but try:

Print Sales @ Walter Cooper


Jake Kohl
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: MarkW_F18] #72734
04/22/06 11:09 AM
04/22/06 11:09 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 395
LA
Acat230 Offline
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Acat230  Offline
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Posts: 395
LA
Quote
The amazing thing is that he saved that pitchpole (photos 248-260). I've got to get some shoes that stick like that. I just wonder how his crew got back on the boat to finish the race.

I was not as lucky (photos 277-288) Even after studing those photos, I still can't beleive the hulls dug as quick as they did. We had overstood the mark and were reaching down to it, but I had my traveler way out and was dumping the main when I was coming off the wire.
I've sailed H20s for 12 years and I'm use to bearing off in high winds with a overpowered main. It just happened so quick. I'm sticking to my story of microburst gust.



Picture 247 - Main way too eased, boat flat, crew forward by beam (look at her right foot bracing on the front beam): pitchpole recipe waiting to happen! Solution, as you make the transition from sailing upwind to bearing away, get that weight (way) aft and fly the weather hull around the mark with the boat powered up (traveller centered, trim main to control heel but keep boat powered). Weight aft keeps the leeward hull up, heeled leeward hull is able to use more bouyancy, and higher speed keeps the water release further aft.

Pictures 277 & 278 - You can see the same thing starting to happen. Crew weight is way too far forward. Look at how the leeward bow is already down. The eased traveller and relatively tight mainsheet is not letting the main twist off. That would allow the top to depower which helps unload the leeward bow.

Here's a good drill. Go out on a windy day and sail upwind. Just practice making the transition from sailing upwind with both crew on the wire to sailing on a beam reach. As you bear off, both crew need to get back by the rear beam immediately. Keep the boat powered up, try to fly the boat through the transition with 10-20 degrees of heel, keep the jib trimmed correctly (don't let it stall), and watch the water release on the leeward hull as it moves aft and the boatspeed picks up. Once the boat is in this trim, it is easy to ease the main and come in off the wire and turn further downwind.

If you can find pictures of Tornado racing, look at how far aft the crews are as they make the transition from the beat to the reaching offset leg. The driver is always on the rear beam keeping the boat under control.

I was out last night in 15-18 knots of onshore breeze on Lake Pontchartrain with a very short and steep chop sailing my A2 which has much smaller bows than any F-18. It was wicked fun to jump on the back end of the boat and fly the hull down to a beam reach. Just by making the transition aft, keeping the hull flying, and keeping the speed up, I never once felt in danger of pitchpoling.

Now go out there and rip into those turns!

Bob Hodges
A-Class USA 230



Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Acat230] #72735
04/22/06 11:22 AM
04/22/06 11:22 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 395
LA
Acat230 Offline
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Acat230  Offline
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LA
See the attached picture.

Driver is at rear beam, weather hull is flying, main is eased and twisty, jib is probably trimmed correctly, boat looks fast and under control and has made the turn. It would be better if the crew was further aft but having the driver in the back of the bus is making it work.


Attached Files
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Acat230] #72736
04/22/06 11:30 AM
04/22/06 11:30 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 395
LA
Acat230 Offline
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Acat230  Offline
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LA
Here's Johnny Lovell and Charlie Ogeltree making the transition. Charlie has just come in off the wire. Look at how much control Johnny has of the boat by trapezing off the rear beam and controlling the power with the centered mainsheet and slightly eased mainsheet. Jib is trimmed perfectly (look at the telltales). Leeward bow is up and speed is fast. An excellent example to learn from from our US silver medalists.

Attached Files
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Acat230] #72737
04/22/06 11:33 AM
04/22/06 11:33 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 395
LA
Acat230 Offline
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Acat230  Offline
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Posts: 395
LA
The next picture is perfection. Again the driver is in the back of the bus easily controlling the powered and very fast boat. Look at the trim of the leeward bow and even with the crew forward, look at how high the bow is and how far aft the water release is. Fantastic!

Attached Files
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Acat230] #72738
04/22/06 11:37 AM
04/22/06 11:37 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 395
LA
Acat230 Offline
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Acat230  Offline
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Posts: 395
LA
Last one, sorry for the repition but these as so good.

This is Gaebler and Struckmann in perfect reaching form about to make the transition to set the chute. Again, powered boat, very fast boatspeed, look at the trim of the leeward bow, about 15 degrees of heel.

The Tornado sailors are the best catamaran sailors in the world, no doubt, and you can learn so much from them.


Attached Files
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Acat230] #72739
04/22/06 12:12 PM
04/22/06 12:12 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
Rolf_Nilsen Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 4,451
West coast of Norway
And here are the world famous norwegian tornado sailors showing to perfection how its done (it's saturday evening here, so please forgive my weak humour)

[Linked Image]

This works very well in moderate winds, in strong winds I am very careful on the reach to B mark. Then it's out traveller and then sheet out. Goal is still to fly a hull, but control and watching your wind is more important. Staying two-up on the trapeze until past B mark can also pay off in stronger winds.

Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Rolf_Nilsen] #72740
04/23/06 08:23 PM
04/23/06 08:23 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,114
BANNED
MauganN20 Offline
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MauganN20  Offline
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BANNED
Team Velocity 2 took some video shots while on the water during Spring Fever.

Check them out at www.velocitysailing.com

Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: MauganN20] #72741
04/23/06 08:37 PM
04/23/06 08:37 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 829
Charleston, SC
NCSUtrey Offline
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NCSUtrey  Offline
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Posts: 829
Charleston, SC
Definitely check out the video(s). My lovely girlfriend is the one who took the video off of Velocity Sailing's Hobie 16 (VS 2, yes we are fully represented in all fleets!). The 3rd video is taken on Joran Lake right here near Raleigh, and the others are from Spring Fever on Lake Hartwell in GA.


Trey
Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Tom Korz] #72742
04/23/06 11:01 PM
04/23/06 11:01 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 471
NC
D
drbinkle Offline
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 471
NC
I ordered some pictures from Walter Cooper Photography today. If anybody's planning on ordering any make sure you do it before the 20% discount expires.

Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: Acat230] #72743
04/24/06 10:29 PM
04/24/06 10:29 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 736
Westport, Ma. U.S.A.
Brian_Mc Offline
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Brian_Mc  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 736
Westport, Ma. U.S.A.
Bob, Thanks for the class!

Re: How's it going at Spring Fever [Re: NCSUtrey] #72744
04/24/06 10:35 PM
04/24/06 10:35 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 736
Westport, Ma. U.S.A.
Brian_Mc Offline
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Brian_Mc  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 736
Westport, Ma. U.S.A.
Tad and Trey, That was really fun to watch! Please thank the lovely girlfriend for me!

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