2 things about the PC hoops.
1) Apparently there is a new bigger version of the toilet bowl hoop, the black version. Maybe the sock is different also.
2) When I saw Nigel's Infusion, the hoop looked the same as my 2004 NF18, but maybe it wasnt, hard to say unless they were side by side. Im not sure a bigger hoop is the answer for the I20 thoughm I belive the snuffer patches, placement of the hoop, and angle that the hoop is attached to the pole would be key.
And BTW, the new I20 midpole with new spin was a bitch, going up and coming down, but its still one of the best boats Ive ever sailed, even with a sucky snuffer.

Why go to mid-pole? I just wanted to try to make and then be able to use it.

mid-pole is less windage.

In waves it wont "scoop" water like the endpole can.

Why don't you name them?

We switched from the Hobie mid pole snuffer hoop to the Performance hoop and like the performance better - it appears to have less friction.

The metal part of the lip on the Hobie hoop works well, preventing the halyard cutting grooves, but the grooves aren't a huge deal and can be easily repaired.

The snuffer that came with the early crop of Bimare 18HTs seems to have more friction than either Hobie or Performance.

The cheapest mid-pole snuffer system I've seen was a plastic roof vent fitting with a small roller on the upper lip, coupled to corrugated black plastic pipe which acted as the sock. Once I had stopped laughing so hard that my ribs hurt I helped the inventor test it on his Nacra 6.0. Well a large dose of humble pie was in order - it worked great, didn't cost much, didn't weigh much, and the boat is plenty fast (1st to finish at Red Fish Reach this year).

Chris.

I'm almost certain they are the same size - I'll measure tonight. I did measure the spinnakers and the sock and it appears that the geometry of the snuffer patches on the Nacra 20 spinnaker were cheated almost 1' on the base figure used to place the patches. This leaves a huge and uneven ball in the middle - it's a long story. I took one of our backup chutes and am having the patches added based on my calculations and we'll see what it snuffs like.

the four I had in mind (going from best to less so)

-1- Mosquito F16 snuffers also used on Altered F16
-2- Spitfire / Stealth F16 snuffers. The latter looks a bit funny but it works incredibally well
-3- AHPC snuffers. Taipan / Capricorn
-4- Hobie Tiger with the stainless steel tube laminated in.




That would be the Guck snuffer.

Wouter

Jake,

isn't the pigtail solution supposed to help with the football getting oversized?

it doesn't in this case. The first and bottom patch is 7' from the two bottom corners of the spinnaker. The top patch is 7' from the head of the sail. The problem is that this leaves a little over 18' between the top and the bottom patch and puts a LOT of extra fabric in the bunch in the middle regardless of where the middle patch ends up or if you put a stopper ball 12" away from the top patch.

The sock is actually closer to 8' in length if you leave the corners of the sail right at the mouth of the hoop. If you use 8' from the three corners to establish the location of the patches, the middle between the top and bottom patches becomes very close to 16' ...easily and perfectly divisible by 8' to put the middle patch smack in the middle of these two patches. This is where I had them added on our backup chute - it should hopefully minimize the ball.

I should have mentioned that the black hoop that is larger came on a new NACRA F18(not an Infusion). I know this because I sent a snuffer cover to a gentlemen in California who states the cover doesnt fit the hoop by a substantial margin.

Actually, there were 10 or 11 carbon hoops made by Mystere for the 18HTs that were raced at Alter Cup a few years ago. Those seemed to work well, too. Although I understood for a while that the boat dealer hadn't paid for them...

I made this Snuffer System. It is very light about 1 pound and works very well. It is loosely based on the EP snuffer. The endpole snuffer that comes with the I-20. Skip Elliott has seen it and likes it a lot. Eileen and I have been sailing with this one for about two years now and have no desire to change. It uses two dousing points and slips into the bag very nicely.

Later,
Dan

Dan, nice snuffer!

And wow, I must tell you I'll be using your lower photo to explain to the young ladies from the KU Sailing Team proper trapeze positioning!

John:
You are just nasty! Actually the angle of the photo is the problem. Sorry to say it is not what it appears to be.

Later,
Dan

Check out Hobie rule 7. It deals with changes and modifications to any Hobiecat boat. It reads:

"Nothing may be changed or removed from any Hobie Cat and will in any way alter the structural intgrity, design function or built in safety features of the boat. All changes shallhave prior written approval. Provided they do not change the basic dsign and configuration, approved changes are: stronger gudgeons, stronger pig-tails; larger diameter wires and running rigging; reinforced flanges not affecting water flow. Except as allowed in these rules, any changes or additions that in any way can be construed as speed devices are not class legal"

ie. Unless the rules specifically say that you can, any modification is non class legal. I haven't checked the specific chapter on the wave but my guess is that it doesn't specifically allow 3rd party sails.

I'd be very suprised if NACRA don't have a similar clause in their rulebook.

Tiger Mike

You need to read the rulebook in it's entirety. Not saying who is right or wrong in this case, but you need to examine the whole document.

Tiger Mike

TigerMike,
I was talking about the Wave Class Association, not the Hobie Class Association. The Wave Class Association allows sails from any manufacturer.

Ok.. sorry - didn't realise such a thing existed apart from the HCA. I hope you enjoy the boat anyway

Tiger Mike