I agree with Dermot. Most of the major races I've been in, the pin is slightly favored.

Committee boat owners prefer that, too.

This is a perfectly set line:


The vantage point is from the pin boat. You can just see the committee boat on the left.

With about 20 - 25 seconds to go, nobody is crowding the committee boat and there's a healthy group headed for the pin (as it turned out, the left was the way to go in this race, but we didn't know it yet).

From right to left, it's Wally Myers, Dan Borg (blue sail), Steve Leo, Pedro Colon (rearing back), unknown, Tom Korz reaching down the line, Peter Nelson, Pat Bisesi (Heineken sail) and myself (also reaching to the pin).

Wally won the pin (although it looks like Tommy got the better start - Dan is getting spat out the back):

NO RC that I know deliberately sets a committe favored line.... THEY WANT the boats down the line... If they are near sighted... they put their mark boat on the pin to sight PMS's... You should name names so they can get educacted (GB might say)!

But I also think that many RC's want a game of musical chairs on the line. IE... not enough room for the fleet to fit on the line with some boats forced into a second row start... Somehow... they feel that this is esential to a well run sailboat race... and I think they are listening to the wrong group of racers here.

My reading of the guidelines is 1 and 1/2 boats of room per boat in the start.., (sometimes they compromise for differences in fleet size in a multistart race and that is understandable). So... with that kind of room... there should not be a big issue of you getting a reasonable start... (on time and clear air) If you choose to fight it out for the best start... have at it...
Remember... the point of the start is not to define a race winner... rather... just get the race going fairly!

IMO, RC's should err on the side of a generous line length... not a sqeaky tight line.

New racers should be coached about how this game is going to play and advised to pick a spot that is not quite so contested.... (Scaring the beejesus out of them does not serve us well as per the post above)... Kudo's to the Syracuse fleet for anouncing well ahead of time a coaching clinic for new or less experienced racers coming to their big regatta..

The pin is an obstacle surrounded by navigable water. If you aren't making it after the gun and you luff up to shoot it, you'd best be sure that no one to windward of you is forced to change course to avoid you or you will be in the wrong.

Hear hear!



Winning the start, or at least getting a good start, is so important that it might well decide the winner. Having a poor start is much worse than a blown tack or another mistake later on.


Bargers are scary, especially when they try to squeeze in between you and the RC boat while you have lots of boats to your leeward with nowhere to go. You can't give room and just have to hope the barger backs off.. Using a "barger boyou (tm)" is a "very good thing(tm)"!

Another common situation is the one where a windward boat is about to be pushed over the starting line by a leeward boat. Leeward hails "up up up" while the windward boat replies "Hey, you are pushing me over" and stays put.
My personal favorite is the ones who still hail "mast abeam- no luffing rights"

Or you may encounter the one (as I did) where you shout "up, up up!" and your opponent responds with "F**k off!"

exactly. spread people out oon the line.



Me too



to which the answer is - "Your problem, not mine"

[/quote]
opponent responds with "F**k off!" [/quote]

There would be a very serious problem, right then, right there, in front of God and everbody!

Not so, according to the rules interpretation provided by the answer to quiz one at Halsey Quiz.

I knew Mike Fahle was right on this, and I am glad somebody finally confirmed it.

[quoteIf you start at the end of the line, would you recommend a inmediate tack to port and once you have gained enough distance tack to starboard. By this time the fleet can be below you on a port tack and YOU have ROW. I have been debating about this, but I have not had a chance to do it yet.

Is this do-able? recomended for a low line start? [/quote]
Well, sorry to be contrary, but I think you've got the tail wagging the dog. There is no single preferred starting tactic. Instead of following a predefined strategy, look at the course and decide where you want to be after the start. Then come up with a plan that puts you there. For example, if there is more wind on the left side of the course, I'll try to start on starboard tack at the pin, so I can reach the breeze faster. If the wind is better on the right, I may start at the committee boat end so I'll be able to tack away early. If the course or line are significantly port favored, or if starting in a port oscillation, I may try to start on port tack and hope to cross the fleet. If things are even all around, then I'll just try to start in clear air, at speed, at the gun.

Define your strategy for the race first, and that will determine how you should start.

Regards,
Eric

Every time I've seen a barging mark in place, it was to protect the committee boat from bargers, not the sailors.

Regards,
Eric

Sorry, but I have to disagree again. If everything is equal, then anywhere in clear air with a clear lane is the place to be (and preferably in the middle). If you start on the far left, then everybody else controls your tack. I don't think that is often a winning strategy. If you want to go left, then go left, but don't let everybody else force you there.

Regards,
Eric

The race committee knows they have set a good line when the racers spread themselves along it. That means they feel it is even. Typically, that means giving a pin-end advantge of 5-10 degrees, but that amount varies by fleet. If the entire fleet bunches up at one end or the other, a good RC will postpone the start and correct the line.


That is the rule of thumb, and the length should also take into consideration wind and current, and the speed of the boats (longer line for high winds, adverse current, or high-performance boats).


We've had opposite experience here. Most RC I've seen tend to set lines that are too long, rather than too short. Either way though, it's better to have the right length. Most skilled Race Committees nowadays use a GPS to set the line.


Excellent advice!

Regards,
Eric

In this case, I recommend heading up just enough so that you have to bear away to avoid contact. Then hail "protest" and foot away. Don't let the windward boat disrupt your start any more than necessary but make sure he did actually fail to keep clear (which is more than not responding to your hail).

Regards,
Eric

In this case, be sure to put "2" along with "11" in the "Rules alleged to have been broken" section of the protest form. If the protest committee finds that your opponent broke rule 2, then the DSQ will become DND ("disqualification non-discardable").

regards,
Eric

Ideal start

10 degree port bias

You get the pin

you sail away form the fleet

You tack onto port after a couple of minutes and cross the whole fleet.




Only done it a few times, but it feels soooooo good crossing a fleet of 100+ boats and (basically) waving good bye to them.

The windward boat is obligated to leave room between the two. The definition of "keeping clear" is:

One boat keeps clear of another if the other can sail her course with no need to take avoiding action and, when the boats are overlapped ont he same tack, if the leeward boat can change course in boath directions without immediatly making contact with the windward boat.

So, the windward boat *must* leave enough room that the leeward boat can change course if it so desires otherwise they may protest (ie if there is a very narrow gap there). Luffing rights aside, the leeward boat is not permitted to plow into the windward boat and *both* boats may be disqualified.

Tiger Mike

Correct. Your on a 16. Get used to it

Tiger Mike

Or just run over the S.O.B! You can camoflage this into a defensible act by "looking off". When you see the barger approaching, look the other direction and don't say a word! After the carnage, say as meekly as possible,"sorry, I just didn't see you."

If you're sailing a H16, it will always come out with less damage because all the other boats are lighter and more fragile. You won't lose anything competitively, because you've already been cheated out of a fair start. If there should be a protest hearing, just don't bother to show. And remember, the more damage you do, the less likely the a** hole will be to try it again!

Of course you'll want to deny everything! Just repeat endlessly, "I'm so sorry."

That's my point. If you move the barging mark downwind a few boat lengths AND make the line between it and the committe boat end of the line a "no go zone" the bargers loose incentive.