| Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle #189608 08/30/09 10:06 PM 08/30/09 10:06 PM |
Joined: May 2006 Posts: 1,383 Kingston SE South Australia JeffS OP
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Posts: 1,383 Kingston SE South Australia | It sounds a bit much to spend on an old boat but this happened to me in Feb this year at a fun regatta in a nice bay not far from home. We on our older Nacra 5.8 were last to leave on a triangle course inside a bay in a stern chase involving cats and trailer sailors. When we left there was only one other cat left to round the first mark on the other side of the bay and it was around 18 knots. When we got to the first mark the wind suddenly changed and hit a sustained 32 knots according to my daughter watching the indicator inside the clubrooms at the time. This turned the first mark into a lea shore with steep 10ft breaking waves that were washing our legs off the back of the boat as we reached along the waves jumping them to get away from the breaking waves. We were still in control when the sidestay broke. This was okay we freed all the rigging, the waves were too big to do much with them as they kept getting washed across the boat so we had to keep jumping the mast, we then tied the mast and sails to the back of the boat. We drifted towards shore until the rescue boat found us, when they took us into tow I wound the rope around the dolphin striker about 4 times with a double wrap around my hands to hold it. The rescue boat went over the first wave and pulled us half through it due to the wave catching the sails which before I could release pulled my hands into the knot fortunately the rope broke so all I got was sore hands and a bent dolphin striker. The rescue boat then said we were too close to the rocks so we had to let the mast and sails go or take our chances getting past the reef, as we let the rigging go a wave pushed the end of the mast through the side of the cat, we attached another rescue line around the dolphin striker to the traveler and we were getting towed. Then a report came through that there was a cat found minus the crew and the race was abandoned so we were asked permission for them to jettison us and search which we readily agreed. When the rescue boat was out of sight we noticed that due to no sails dragging in the water we were heading in the along shore drift towards the reef at the mouth of the bay with the bigger waves. Another boat coming to join the search found the missing sailor 1km outside the search area. When the rescue boat came back to us we weren’t far from the reef but they got us in tow and it took 90 minutes to get us back on a 15ft towline, each time the cabin cruiser went up a wave it lost forward momentum and we surfed down to come up next to it with waves breaking over us the whole time, this action of the tow rope demolished our bow foil. By the time we got back I had hypothermia and the rescue boat crew were badly seasick. Our Nacra 5.8 had no mast, sails, stays, one hull had been holed, the bow foil was ruined, the dolphin striker was wrecked, the traveler track was twisted up and ruined, the top of the decks were partially ground away by the mast sliding over it. Once in the clubrooms they couldn’t believe how happy I was even though my boat was a wreck but I was relieved to get home in one piece after a potentially life threatening experience. When I posted on an Australian cat sight questions about replacing the sails, mast etc a guy got stuck into me because catamaran insurance premiums will go up due to my claim. All this happened because I didn’t replace older sidestays even though there was no rust stain when I purchased the boat, I always will now.
Jeff Southall Current boats Nacra 5.8 1703 Animal Scanning Services Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider Nacra 18 Square Arrow 1576
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: JeffS]
#189609 08/30/09 10:34 PM 08/30/09 10:34 PM |
Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 586 Hobart, Tasmania, Oz. Dazz
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Posts: 586 Hobart, Tasmania, Oz. | Why is it we always learn the hard way....
$50 diamond wire broke = $4000 damage $150 dolphin striker = $2500 damage + 30 man hours work.
I replace all wires every 2 years now.
Last edited by Dazz; 08/30/09 10:34 PM.
C2 AUS 222 by Goodall design "Darph Bobo"
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: Dazz]
#189611 08/30/09 11:46 PM 08/30/09 11:46 PM |
Joined: Jul 2001 Posts: 2,844 42.904444 N; 88.008586 W Todd_Sails
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Posts: 2,844 42.904444 N; 88.008586 W | IMHO, if you're using your boat much, 2 years is too long between standing rigging replacements.
F-18 Infusion #626- SOLD it!
'Long Live the Legend of Chris Kyle'
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: Robi]
#189615 08/31/09 01:09 AM 08/31/09 01:09 AM |
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 951 Brisbane, Queensland, Australi... ncik
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Posts: 951 Brisbane, Queensland, Australi... | Surprised the rescue boat left when they were already engaged in a rescue! Should not happen. One definite rescue is better than 2 failed rescues.
Last edited by ncik; 08/31/09 01:09 AM.
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: ncik]
#189620 08/31/09 04:37 AM 08/31/09 04:37 AM |
Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,528 Looking for a Job, I got credi... scooby_simon Hull Flying, Snow Sliding.... |
Hull Flying, Snow Sliding....
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Posts: 3,528 Looking for a Job, I got credi... | Surprised the rescue boat left when they were already engaged in a rescue! Should not happen. One definite rescue is better than 2 failed rescues. If man-overboard / lost crew; all go. I would have gone with the rescue crew - as said hardware can be replaced. I would also have gone to HELP; Additional factors for the inso co; I LEFT MY BOAT, to help save a life.
F16 - GBR 553 - SOLD I also talk sport here | | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: scooby_simon]
#189629 08/31/09 07:50 AM 08/31/09 07:50 AM |
Joined: Apr 2003 Posts: 67 Daytona Beach Jeff_Bowers
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Posts: 67 Daytona Beach | Coated or uncoated wire? I went to uncoated and I get many years out of my rigging. The big plus is that I can see if there is a problem.
Jeff Bowers Mystere 6.0(sometimes XL)
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: Jeff_Bowers]
#189693 08/31/09 11:51 AM 08/31/09 11:51 AM |
Joined: Jul 2001 Posts: 1,200 Vancouver, BC Tornado
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Posts: 1,200 Vancouver, BC | Glad to hear it came out alright.
Question: Why did you tow from the dolphin striker? That is not a strong point when pulled fore/aft. Much better to take some wraps around the main beam. Ideally, using a bridle "Y" line off the bows or main beam is the best solution. Losing the dolphin striker could potentially fail the main beam, thought in this case losing the rig loads probably save the beam.
Mike Dobbs Tornado CAN 99 "Full Tilt"
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: Tornado]
#189699 08/31/09 12:02 PM 08/31/09 12:02 PM | andrewscott
Unregistered
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Unregistered | We drifted towards shore until the rescue boat found us, when they took us into tow I wound the rope around the dolphin striker about 4 times with a double wrap around my hands to hold it. Why did you tow from the dolphin striker? I would not hold onto any towline and never wrap it around my hand...
Last edited by andrewscott; 08/31/09 12:02 PM.
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: Flip57]
#189815 09/01/09 01:55 AM 09/01/09 01:55 AM |
Joined: May 2006 Posts: 1,383 Kingston SE South Australia JeffS OP
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Posts: 1,383 Kingston SE South Australia | I really put that story together in response to a post I saw about repairing a corroded mast base, it struck me that I had repaired a corroded mast base on the 5.8 not long before the stay failed. It shows how a little problem can get a lot bigger and inconvenience a lot of people. When the rescue boat left us they asked our permission and that other sailor was the priority, we probably should have abandoned the boat and gone with them. I didnt have a hole in the tramp near the mast for the rope to go around the beam and considered cutting a hole in the tramp. Its a good suggestion to make a Y bridle from each side of the beam I would do that in future with the jib sheet. My current boat has a bridle I would just tie onto. My side stay broke well down inside the swage where you would never see it, it had a small rust stain the same as my near new 5.7 stays have a small rust stain now.
Jeff Southall Current boats Nacra 5.8 1703 Animal Scanning Services Nacra 5.8 1667 Ram Raider Nacra 18 Square Arrow 1576
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: JeffS]
#189870 09/01/09 11:32 AM 09/01/09 11:32 AM |
Joined: Jul 2001 Posts: 1,200 Vancouver, BC Tornado
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Posts: 1,200 Vancouver, BC | You can tow from near one end of the main beam, inner gunwale side. No need to balance it by a second line on the other side. You can easily control off centerline force on the boat by steering (assuming you've got rudders and center/dagger boards help).
We were towed in two weeks ago from ~8 miles out in the channel after a 6+ hr race round the island when the winds died. We had an I20 in front of us on the tow line. We tied off to his rear beam, left end and I wrapped the end off to our right side main beam end. Worked well.
BTW, I like to wrap, not tie off the line to the boat...just in case you need to release quickly. We hand-hold the loose end...all load is taken by the wraps.
Mike Dobbs Tornado CAN 99 "Full Tilt"
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: Tornado]
#189871 09/01/09 11:37 AM 09/01/09 11:37 AM | andrewscott
Unregistered
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Unregistered | BTW, I like to wrap, not tie off the line to the boat...just in case you need to release quickly. We hand-hold the loose end...all load is taken by the wraps. good advice | | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: ]
#189877 09/01/09 11:59 AM 09/01/09 11:59 AM |
Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 976 France pepin
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Posts: 976 France | BTW, I like to wrap, not tie off the line to the boat...just in case you need to release quickly. We hand-hold the loose end...all load is taken by the wraps. good advice Good advice as long as you never ever wrap it around your hand like the original poster did. | | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: pepin]
#189901 09/01/09 01:26 PM 09/01/09 01:26 PM |
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 3,969 brucat
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Posts: 3,969 | We've all been there, even on newer boats. In my case, I have no excuse, except for ignorance (aka "lessons learned")...
On the H16, there is a split tramp, so it's easy to tie a tow line to the crossbar. Of course, I used the dolphin striker once and it got bent.
On the H16, there are no "dead end" fittings (the kind that terminate in a thimble). They are all just wrapped around a stainless loop and use crimp connectors. Very easy to inspect for damage. Of course, one time, I had a broken wire and ignored it, dropped the mast in a regatta a few weeks later. I think this was caused by my storage "technique" (just wrap it up and tie it down).
So now, I am extremely careful about how my wires lie before securing them on the trailer. I avoid kinks, small-radius bends, etc. Basically, if the wire is fighting me, I stop and do it over until everything lies down nicely.
Mike | | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: brucat]
#190003 09/02/09 11:25 AM 09/02/09 11:25 AM |
Joined: Jul 2001 Posts: 2,844 42.904444 N; 88.008586 W Todd_Sails
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Posts: 2,844 42.904444 N; 88.008586 W | Speaking of wires while storing or trailering;
On my last boat, (in the avatar), When the boat was on the trailer, and the mast was down, I would only have one bend in the shrouds/trap wires. I ran them forward, so that the one bend was held by a bungee cord to the spreader on the mast while on the trailer. This seemed the best method I used thru all the years for wire life, ease of use and breakdown, etc. So, one bugee, thru 6 cables, which hooked to the spreader. Never had a problem doing this, even trailering long distances.
Now I realize, if you have a carbon mast, many people just take the wires off while trailering.
F-18 Infusion #626- SOLD it!
'Long Live the Legend of Chris Kyle'
| | | Re: Why replace sidestays, forestays and bridle
[Re: Todd_Sails]
#190021 09/02/09 01:57 PM 09/02/09 01:57 PM |
Joined: Feb 2009 Posts: 678 Palm Beach County TheManShed
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Posts: 678 Palm Beach County | I lost my rig once from a bad stay. Way too old and I keep using it. Replaced all rigging then lost it again a few months later from a bad crimp on the new rigging. Sometimes you just can't win. Both times nobody hurt and no damage.
Mike Shappell www.themanshed.comTMS-20 Builder G-Cat 5.7 - Current Boat NACRA 5.2 - early 70's | | |
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