I have a Prindle 18 that I want to add a spinnaker to. I have all of the hardware, but I need a sail. My plan was to just use the hobie 18 spinnaker, but I was just reading the install instructions and it is sheeted from the rear beam (if you don’t have wings).

So, I have these questions:

1. Can you keep the lines that run to the rear beam out of the way upwind? I feel like we will always be sitting on them and getting the main sheet tangled with them and the leeward spin sheet will be dragging in the water when not in use.

2. Is there another class sail (or sail that has already been designed) available like a nacra 5.5 (or f17) spinnaker that is sheeted to the shrouds? There are no class requirements (i.e. pole length) that I have to worry about I just want to bring my apparent forward and have some fun. So, I could make it fit. I think my mast is 28’ 8”.

3. What are the best Beachcat Spinnaker makers to work with? I have not found any sailmakers in the usa that advertise beachcat spinnakers. I saw a Calvert screecher in one of my catamaran books. I am pretty sure our local sail maker Haarstick has little experience with this type of sail, but have made asymmetrics for slugs. Would it be a bad idea to use them?

Thank you for your help. I am the first person at my club to add a spinnaker, so I may have a question or two more.

Matt

As you say, Calvert know what he does, as does your olympic silver medalist on the Tornado, Charlie Ogletree (Ullman) do. Jay Glaser http://www.glasersails.com/ should be a safe buy as well.



In Europe there are several good lofts, but the 'hottest' just now are Landenberger, Gran Segel and Ullman Sicily.

I think the swedes at Gran Segel still have the edge when it comes to fast spi's for the Tornado, but they do custom jobs as well. As we are moving into the cold non-sailing season here in scandinavia now, you can probably get a discount on their normal prices.


Sorry, but I dont know about any class spi's who might fit your boat. But the large spi's sheeted to the aft-beam are mostly history now i think. The short-footed spis have proven faster, at least that's the trend.

just use an F18 spin. Nacra, Hobie etc.

Rolf,

Thanks for the good leads. I will call the lofts if custom sails are necessary.

Dave,

I was looking at the catsailer store

H-18/18SX Luff(25.3') Leech(22.0') Foot(11.0')
Tiger Luff(27.66') Leech(22.0') Foot(12.0')

I wonder if the sail sold on this site is sheeted to the shroud. The foot is shorter than the Tiger. I emailed Rick.

Matt

Matt, I recently purchased a spinaker for my Hobie 16 from Whirlwind and really the best. Great quality and fantastic shape at a good price. Better than the new Genakers coming from Hobie Cat Europe. Check their website and give Owner Chip a call. www.whirlwindsails.com or e mail chip@whirlwindsails.com Good luck.

I used an Inter 18 f-18 chute on my N 5.5 uni, sheeted to the shroud with a 12' pole. I later moved the system to my P-19, still sheeting to the shroud. It worked fine. I now use a near-New England class N 6.O chute with a 15' pole and sheeted to the rear beam. I've had no trouble with the sheets being much in the way; if you know you're not going to be using the kite for a while, you can snug the sheets a bit and put slip knots in them. Oh, another thing: I use single ratchets on the rear beam, and turning blocks near the shrouds, so I get a good 150-degree wrap on my ratchets, and so the sheets actually exit to the boat at shrouds.

I've got a couple of extremely low mileage F18 Tiger spins @ $550 each.

Drop me a note - mike at sailmax dot biz

I thought that an F18 sail would be too powerful for the prindle 18. It seems like it might be ok though. It is not much bigger than the Hobie 18 design. Does anyone think I will have a problem?

Andrew,

Thanks for the advice on the sheeting. I already have the blocks. How did you attach the head? I have seen a few different designs. I was just going to go with a tang and a block connected with a shackle, but was not sure on what block to use. I have also seen designs with a ring connected to a line that goes around the mast.

Thanks,

Matt

Matt,

The F18 chute is certainly a higher aspect ratio than the Hobie spinnaker for the TheMightyHobie18 and should easily sheet to just in front of the shrouds. You should get a luff and hoist measurement before planning the modification. On the F18, the spinnaker attaches very high on the mast a little over 2/3 the distance from the hound to the top - this could be too high for a Hobie 18 or at the very least, leave you with a setup that you have to be careful to maintain mainsheet tension on to support the mast (we have to be careful on the Nacra F18). You could probably lower the spinnaker pole to compensate for the extra hoist height. I don't think an F18 spinnaker is going to be any more powerful than anything else because the trend in spinnaker design is getting flatter and flatter...but hoist height could be problematic.

Secondly, your attachment point will work to a tang or other fixed position on the mast - but you will have difficulty achieving proper mast rotation because the spinnaker will want to pull the mast forward. Most current systems allow the spinnaker hoist point to rotate freely around the mast so that it doesn't affect mast rotation.

Wouter has a couple of web pages (and a Word document) that does good job explaining several ways to rig the upper end of the spinnaker - but I don't have the link handy.

Jake

The leach according to the catsailor site is 22’ my mast is 28’ 8” (I think, I will measure it this weekend). My Prindle 18 mast is all aluminum. But the Hobie 18 sail on the catsailor site also has a 22’ leach; it just has a shorter foot.

How do the systems work to not affect rotation?

I read Wouter’s Document and saw how he did it. He used a cheek block and then a steel ring and a line that goes around the mast back to the ring. I did not see any alternative ways outlined.

Matt

I rivetted an eyestrap right at the masthead and spliced up a 2' (or so) leash for a TiLite airblock. At the point where the lower loop of the leash hangs, I drilled holes through the walls of the luff track at the back of the mast, and ran another piece of Spectra around the mast and through the lower loop on the leash. The eyestrap takes the vertical load, and the loop transfers the horizontal component of the load to the aft portion of the mast, eliminating any tendency for the kite to reduce rotation. I can take pictures if you like.

Aaaaa...sorry - I missed that it was a Prindle. The F18 masts are roughly around 29'6" so you would likely be OK with an F18 spinnaker by making sure your spinnaker pole height was correct.

The systems use one line as a "belt" that goes around the perimiter of the mast. A second line, placed vertically, goes to an eye strap above the "belt" and down through it where it shortly ties to a turning block. The halyard runs through this turning block. The block swings like a pendulum from the vertical line while the "belt" line keeps it constrained close to the mast allowing the spinnaker hoist point to rotate around the mast but stay close to it.

Andrew if it is not too much trouble to take a picture I would appreciate it. I think I understand what both are you are describing and it will probably be free for me because I already have the necessary hardware.

Matt

Jake-
You mentioned something about being careful stressing the mast with your spin- is this because you risk inverting the mast with the spin if you don't trim it right? I also seem to remember some thread about the importance of keeping the mainsheet somewhat tight on spin runs to provide aft support of the mast (I would think for this reason). Should the spin be run to the very top of the mast?
I need lots of pictures to figure this out (brain has probs with thinking of all the ropes)

Remember that the mast does not have any integrated support above the hound where the stays attach. The higher up you place your spinnaker head, the more bending force you apply to the mast. The lower you attach your spinnaker (Bill Roberts recommended up 1/3 the distance from the hound to the tip of the mast maximum for goof proof sailing) the less chance you have of inverting or breaking the mast. The higher you go, the more the mast depends on mainsheet tension to support it. Monohulls that run masthead spinnakers use backstays and/or checkstays to support the mast to be able to run spinnakers as high as possible - we only have mainsheet tension through the sail to support up high.

I think the F18 Spin is going to be much higher than 1/3 of the way up. Take a look at this pic. My mast is 10" shorter and the forestay attachment point may be lower. I'll measure this weekend.

Matt