For the past month or two I've been really wanting to get a H16. A few days ago I went sailing with one of my dad's friends in Stuart on his 24 foot trimaran, and he was telling me stories of when he had a 16 back in the 80s and said it was a great, fun, boat, but that I should look into a "modern boat" like a Nacra. "The Hobie was designed more than 30 years ago by a surfer, not a sailor!" he said. He raved about the Inter 20 and Nacra 6.0, but these are way too big for me. I'll be sailing solo sometimes, and I want something simpler and faster to rig.

When I got back I searched this forum for anything I could find about the 5.0. I also found one from '98 selling on Chris's Miami Catamarans site for $2500, which is a near perfect price-point. I've found lots of H16's nearby (cheaper too), but they're all from the '70s or '80s and have at least a worrisome amount of delamination in the hulls.

I know a lot of people are pretty passionate about one cat company over the other, but I guess what I wanna know is, what makes you be so loyal to one brand over the other? I'd like to hear what kind of experiences I'd be having - and what I'd be missing! - if I went with a Nacra 5.0 over a Hobie 16, or vice versa.


A bit about how I plan to sail the cat: I live in Orlando, FL, and will be trailering over to the coast to sail in the indian river and in the atlantic. I've read about surfing a cat, and that sounds like lots of fun if you know what you're doing! I don't plan to race very often. I'll be a senior in high school, so I'll be sailing with a friend mainly to hang out and satisfy our apetites for speed. Not to mention, taking a few girls out too for some good high school fun (you baby boomers were there one day, right?).

We can make this thread another one of those Holy War Hobie vs. any-other-brand kind of skirmishes, or a controlled-chaos kind of debate. And yes, there's a difference between debate and war =) Most of all I'm just trying to decide on the best boat for me.

Thanks!

The Nacra is an easier boat to sail and can hold more people, and won't pitchpole, so better for casual sailing.

But if you are into racing and there is a big H16 fleet around where you are then you want a h16.

I'll agree the 5.0 is a better boat from the racing stand point (unless racing other H16's, then it's a mute point). As far as just flying hulls and having fun? I've got three sons just a few years older than you (20, 21 & 23). Get a 1980 or later H16. Trust me, the girls will think it's "cool".

is it easier to fly a hull on a H16? Isn't the 5.0 lighter than the 16?

as for the "girls will think it's 'cool'" aspect, i agree the hobie is more aesthetically pleasing. especially those banana-shaped hulls. what makes the H16 more fun?

speaking of hulls, what is the composition of the hulls in a 5.0? fiberglass-foam sandwich?

The H16 is a pretty tough boat and can take a good beating. You will go plety fast to satify your need for speed... even in an old design.

Trust me... you will be racing almost every time you are on the water. Any time more than one boat are near each other there is a race <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Also, for casual sailing you need to think if the availability and cost of spare parts. For the H16 it is very good. I'm not sure about the Narca.

Good luck in whatever you choose.

is it easier to fly a hull on a H16?

Maybe not easier, it just seems like the H16 "wants" to be on one hull at about a 30 degree angle.


Isn't the 5.0 lighter than the 16?

On paper 36 pounds lighter, don't know about 5.0 variations but 80's H16 may vary as much as 45 pounds from the 320 pound minimum.


as for the "girls will think it's 'cool'" aspect, i agree the hobie is more aesthetically pleasing. especially those banana-shaped hulls. what makes the H16 more fun?

See the above..."wants" to fly a hull.


speaking of hulls, what is the composition of the hulls in a 5.0? fiberglass-foam sandwich?

Yup.

Get the Nacra! it's a 'real boat' of the 20th century. It will handle so much better, and wont fall over when you least expect it.
The Hobie is a dinosaur.

Double trapped screaming reach! <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> You have to experience it. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Can we count that as two votes for Hobie?

NOT!

hahaha that's amazing... not gonna lie, that makes me wanna go Hobie in a heartbeat.

From the replies it sounds like the Nacra is a more stable, forgiving, and overall-better-designed boat, but that the Hobie is more fun in an almost unpredictable and - shall we say - flirtatious way?

Berny - you sound like my friend who told me the Nacra is a more "modern" boat. How does it handle better? I've never sailed one so your input is appreciated! thanks

Does the Nacra like to fly a hull like the Hobie does? How is the overall thrill of the boat? Is there more adrenaline involved with a Hobie 16?

again, thanks for the replies! I'm going down on friday to look at the 5.0, and the price has been lowered to $2200. this includes a trailer, new tiller extension, reenforced keels (from dragging on the beach i suppose?), and good sails. sounds like a really great deal! basically, i have to make a decision which to go with really soon because this 5.0 is the only Nacra available in florida and after friday the seller is moving away for a few months!

and i should ask a few other things...

Does the Hobie sail better in 3 to 5 foot seas? It just seems like it would with those curvy hulls that would seem to slice through the wake with less resistence than the straight hull design of the nacra.

also, i hear how easy the Hobie is to trailer because of how easy it is to stra[ it down right near the pylons. Is it more difficult to trailer a Nacra? I'll be trailering 90 minutes on the highway to the coast to do most of my sailing, so trailering is important to me too.

basically guys, I'm tryin to get the most bang for my buck. i gotta year left in high school, and then - depending where i go - might not be sailing at all (except when i come home) for 4 years at least. after college though? hell yeah

Will,

I really don't think you can go wrong with either boat. In my opinion, I think the Nacra is slightly beefier and I do prefer the feel of the helm of the Nacras (very nuetral...i.e. doesn't tug at you...and responsive). The H16 certainly has the popularity and you will probably find parts and information easier to come by for the H16 although all the factory parts for the 5.0 are still available from Performance Catamarans.

With regard to flying a hull - they both will fly 'em high easily. The H16 has a little more of a reputation for punishing those that fly the hulls and have their crew weight too far forward. If the bow goes under a wave, the shape of the top of the deck tends to trip the boat on it's nose. Usually you will loose your footing in the deceleration and you'll capsize. All catamarans, including the 5.0 up to the 130' monster G-class cats, are capable of such a pitch-pole but some are more susceptible than others.

PS...I get lost when you guys say the bannana hulls are 'aesthetically pleasing' - really now. <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Jake has pretty much said it all, and I say this as one who LOVES Hobies! I've never had a Nacra, but have sailed on some, and think they are great boats. The one thing I would've thought the Hobie would be better for is surfing, but not having tried it on a Nacra...? Let us know what you get.

How is it that no one has taken this guy to task about the "baby boomer" comment?
<img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
not that I have been around a long time BUT... if you want to race on your budget, get the H16 (only because there are so many). If you don't, get the Nacra.

PTP - haha yeah i was waiting for someone to react to my baby boomer witticism. both my parents are boomers ('51 and '54) so i know the species well <img src="http://www.catsailor.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Brian_Mc - would you care to elaborate on some of the Nacra experinces you've had? How were their (the boats') personalities different?

just a quick question again - does the nacra have daggerboards? on craigslist i saw some 5.0 daggerboards for sale, but last i checked the 5.0 uses keels instead of boards right? correct me if i'm wrong.

Mate, the Hobie has a big following because it was marketed well early on. There are lots of older boats around and usually good fleets racing in most areas. They have a cult status which tends to overlook their bad behaviour but really they are a dog of a boat. Sit too far forward and they pitchpole, too far aft and they'll fall over backwards. They're a bit like balancing a ball on your nose, it can be done but it's mostly a big pain in the ar$e.

By comparison, the Nacra will do most everything better than the H16 and will in general be a nicer, easier boat to sail.

This is the same trick they always pull. Note that nobody actually writes that the nacra 5.0 will just as easily pull two people to the trapeze and scream along ! But they still give you the false impression that the Hobie 16 does this more easily.

I know both boats rather well and honestly the Nacra 5.0 is a better design in the way of handling and performance. It will also take a spinnaker better is you ever decided to go that route (which I espext you will considering your teenage need for speed credentials)

The Nacra 5.0 is a more refined design that cuts through the water better and it will be a stiffer boat then the Hobie 16 because of the way the beams are drectly connected to the hulls and the usage of larger beams. The pilon design of the Hobie is not the best setup in the way of stiffness.

Additionally the raised trampoline on the Hobie starts hurting my feet and butt after a while. On the Nacra 5.0 you are sitting and standing on the more flat hulls and so you won't have the same here.

The Nacra 5.0 has skegs (no daggerboards or asymmetrical hulls) and these are better for upwind performance then asymmetric hulls. Actually the difference between skegs and daggerboards in the way of performance is surprisingly small.

If the nacra 5.0 is young enough then you'll also have mast rotation control, a loose mainsail foot and better downhaul control. All these will allow you to trim the mainsail better and that can make a noticeable difference in performance.

Most older Hobies (the ones that are second hand) have sliding (main and jib) traveller cars instead of ball baring ones. The nacra will have ball baring traveller cars and that works alot better especially when salt and dust collects in them. In my experience older H16 main traveller cars jam up easily. When I worked for the sailing school as instructor I often kicked them across with my feet. But these boats were often old !

And I can go on.

But basically in the way of design the nacra 5.0 is just alot better. The forte of the H16 is the strong class following it has world wide and the general availability of cheap second hand parts. But if you are not really interested in racing then the nacra 5.0 you mention sounds like a really good deal. And I personally would go for it.

Wouter