Why do we want an F20 class in the US, are there not already plenty of places to race our 20 ft boats as is.

Is it just to be able to put any manufacturers sail on our boat and still race without a penalty? or add carbon rudders and a carbon Boom? or a carbon mast to a Hobie 20?

In order for an F20 class to exist in the us there must be an agreed set of rules, a governing body, and several boats racing under the rules, then there would be an official PN number and then anyone can do what they want to their boat even if there is no one else in their area that has a similar boat.

What is the motivation for and F20 class in the US? Because this site is only a start it must be moved to the next step or it will just be another good idea that never got any grip in reality. There must be a reason/need for the class. What is it?

Pipe Dream! Level racing is what we can support.



Yes. Every race that's non hobie welcomes the 20 footers.... They would love to give 5 of any kind a class trophy. But there appears to be very little interest in racing the 20's around buoys in the US and Canada.



The only reason would be to go buoy racing and score first across the line.

BUT... Its very clear that we don't have that much interest in racing the 20's around buoys. Outside of the Tornado class in the Miami OCR which is an international event (20 boats or so). The best turnout is 10 boats at the Tradewinds. Followed by 6 or 7 boats for two buoy races in Wisconson. Catfight lists 8 or so N20's and 4 Tornado's. (To me... this will be level racing... No formula will deal with the beam issue.) Actually, I think the level racing will be pretty fair until it starts blowing stink.

Distance Racing is different animal.

From what I can see. The Nacra 6.0's and Mystere 6.0's and Hobie 20's are still around and the owners want to race them once or twice a season.... They are not going to invest a lot of money to upgrade the boat to a formulae rule for a few events a year...
Not to mention... it did not seem to work out well in New England ... the 6.0's with chutes could not keep up with the N20's around the cans. Portsmouth and Texel do a good job of rating the boats... with out the drive for buoys racing... I believe most of these owners are happy with the status quo.

Distance racing is another animal and every dog could have it's day. but there is not much need for a formulae to regulate the racing.

Seems to me... that the builders have to judge the market for 20 foot racing boats. If they agreed on a formula which lowers the boat weight and is fun to sail... you could see an f20 class... but I think they have been there and done that and don't see much future... (F18's and down the road F16's have the market place today) Rather... it seems to me that they would like to build their concept boats and compete for the distance racing prize of first to finish. (M20's... Eagle 20's, Hobie carbon concept, CFR 20).
Maybe that is the formula! 20 feet or less in lenght... Do what you want!

One other minor reson for an F20 class would be that you could dump the class legal equipment list. But while that might be appealing. ... you also loose the Factory's efforts in making a national event happen. You add the need for measurement (if you want to get serious) You add the need for SOMEBODY to run the organization. (I thnk hell freezes before somebody takes on this challenge)

In the end... the "Why do we need this class?" doesn't have great answers!

It hasn't happened yet... and I can't see a reason for it to happen now.

My proposal... Level racing for Tornado's, Nacra 20's and any other sloop rigged boat that runs a chute. Distance or bouys. Collect times as well and score on portsmouth or texel. Just go racing!





















Correct me if I have overlooked somebody!


Distance Racing adds huge variables that can't be controlled and will favor one design over another. Eg reaching legs.

One point I like about a 20 footer class, is the increased crew weight it can carry competetively (if designed for it). Especially so with the more modern hullshapes.

the difference in PN time for the current production 20ft boats on a 1 hour race is 3 min 24 sec. after some research I have seen that the leaders in a one design class tend to break away from the wanabees at about 7-9% or 4.2 min an hour. What does this mean you say???
it means that the PN number difference in boats is within the error of the individuals sailing them. So it is not likely that boat speed is the highest contributing factor to the racing. I would venture to bet that anyone that beats you on their boat could beat you on your boat.
I am one of the 7% rules I lose most of my races to the top I20 sailor by + / - 7% there is a level of seriousness that I do not possess. however I am still a proponent of F20 because I would like to be more creative that tbe class allows.
PN Data 11 kt wind 1 hr race.
Boat PN elapsed corrected.
Nacra 20 60.2 1:00:12 1:40:00
N6.0 w spin 63.3 1:03:18 1:40:00
H20 w spin 63.6 1:03:36 1:40:00
Tornado int w sp 60.5 1:00:30 1:40:00

EU has adopted the N20 sailplan as an F20 class, so w/o even knowing it we are F20. So, no it's not a pipe dream. However, here the N20 is the only one that fits the new sail plan. There are actually quite a few N20s in EU sailing with the large sail plan. Does this mean a N20 worlds is in the near future?

As far as I have been able to find out, the "EU F20 class" is as dead as a dodo. There was some initative and racing in 2000/2001, but since then I have not seen any information about a F-20 class. The late F-20 class was based on the N20 and the Hobie Fox. So saying that the N20 is a F20 is a little far fetched in my opinion, as I dont see any F-20 class or class activites. Many N20's out there racing, but not as F-20s

To complicate this, there are builders/designers claiming to be building F-20s, which dont fit within the N20 parameters or the rules posted on: http://www.f20.nl/
Ref: http://www.morrellimelvin.com/sailboats/racing/020-Ventillo.html


I agree with Mark and Marc, the goal for a F-20 class must be racing first over the finish line. Be it distance events or around the cans.. Toss the Tornados, N20s, N6.0s and other non exotics into the F-20 bag and go racing. Problem is of course as Mark points out, the owners dont want to go racing often enough. The right persons to orchestrate and get a F-20 class flying is not here and there is little interest from manufacturers.

I want to (and will) do a 20 foot racing cat anyhow, for my personal enjoyment and distance racing. As I said earlier, I believe the F-20 class should be targeted for crews a bit heavier than what is competitive in the F-16/18 and Tornado class.