I'm a nefarious little bugger aren't I ?
Indeed, my personal preference for the longer hulls comes from the desire to finish up with a good performing boat.
I see no point or economical viability for a new class that doesn't convincingly beat the current crop of small cats out there as well as the fastest dinghies (both are pretty much 13 foot and longer as well)
With the choice of being lightweigt for reasons of performance and ease of handling c.q. TRULY car toppable the bouyance of the F12 is such that it is disadvantaged in the dive resistance when compared to its heavier competition. By making its hulls shorter then the competition as well we enter into a situation where it becomes very hard to outperform the competition (if not downright impossible) because the mast height and sail area are limited to significantly smaller proportions.
The last thing I want to happen is HURT catsailing as a whole by proving to the dinghy sailors out there that small cats simply can not perform. They will errornously inteprete that as being applicable to the whole catamaran scene even if some of them know better. As we all know they are trying desperately to convince themselfs that mono's aren't fundamentally slower then cats or tris.
I fully admit to wanting an F12 that is a "a fast, high-performance boat"
But "... to fit the boat that he had already started designing". Is not true. We (Phill and I) started out with the 12 long hull, I discovered its drawbacks and proposed to solve them by going a little longer.
But those choices are slanted to bring you to the conclusion desired by their author, and they are based upon the premise that what is wanted for the Formula 12 class is .
Are your comments "slanted" because you are both an a wave owner and an active wave class volunteer ?
Isn't "slanted" a bit harsh word to use here, makes it sound like I have some evil plan for world domination ?
And all the math proves is that Wouter believes the kind of boat he envisions building cannot be done as a 12-footer.
Correct, but the right question here of course is whether the boat I envision is different from what is envisioned by others. Please all raise your hands who in favour of a F12 that is not fast or capable of beating Laser 1's, Hobie Wave's or Dragoons on the water ?
So, in other words, if he can't build his dream boat to fit within a Formula 12 class, he is going to stretch the class to fit a 12'10" boat.
Well, I think you guys deserve to hear the truth about this here indeed. If the F12 ruleset finally decided upon doesn't interest me then I may well continue with the design as I envision it and set up a different organisation around it. This design could then indeed be a one-design setup.
I'm really not interested in making a design that ONLY 7-12 year old kids can sail singlehandedly. I don't believe this age group is dependable enough for parents to justify spending a couple of thousant US$ or Euro on. Also these kids grow out of the age (weight) group too quickly and because they are then still too young and small for Hobie 14, Hobie 16's and God forbid F16's they will be forced to go back to dinghies like the laser-1 and 29-er anyway meaning that we'll have lost them again to the dark side. F14 isn't here yet and I don't really think it is going to be. So in effect there is no follow-up to the F12 unless the F12 stretches itself to make the link up with H16's or F16's. Also I think alot of these kids want to sail with a friend instead of solo, putting these crews in the 12-19 years weight range.
Also, 10 additional inches makes a MUCH greater difference in a small boat like that than it would if you are talking about, say, a Solaris 42 if it is actually 42'10".
That was a point I made in my own initial posting as well. And this point works both ways. 10 inches less can also make a huge difference in a negative sense.
If Wouter builds a boat almost 13 feet long and calls it an F12 and expects it to be representative of a Formula 12 class, a Formula 12 class will never come into existence.
And my plans for world domination will then have SUCCEEDED ! YEAAAH !
If he proceeds with that particular design, he should call it something other than F12 and then make that particular boat a one-design.
Because you hold copyright to the name F12 ?
Meanwhile, it would be nice if somebody would come up with some box rules for a Formula 12 class and limit it to 12 feet
As long as that somebody isn't Wouter, right ?
Well I'm going to use my old trick again.
If somebody wants to replacement me as the donkey who is pulling this F12 car then by all means do so !
I will step down immediately and hand over the bit to the new person.
Nothing has changed in this respect to 2 weeks ago when I made the exact same offer.
I take note that even the very vocal persons of last time like Pat or Jake didn't respond in anyway to that offer.
Now I really want to have a F12 design that works on all fronts and that will be succesful. I'm not in any way looking forward to the huge amount of work that it will require to get it too succeed like that. Remember I already know what it is like as I've done it one time already with another class. So I'm really not doing this because it is so darn alot of fun to do, I think it is necessary and the right thing to do. So if somebody else wants to do the right thing then I'm happy to throw the burden on his or her shoulders.
But please don not think that this F12 project is rigged to do what I want. I don't have some hidden agenda. I may well change my mind if convincing counter arguments are made. At least you all should give me that much credit.
Wouter
