Bob,

Thanks for your input.

You wrote:
>> If you go by hypostasis based on false premises, you end up with a P-16 being a better design than a M-20… like in one of the posts above.

I hope you weren't getting this from my post comparing the M20 to the P16. It wasn't my intention to conclude that an M20 was inferior to a P16! My post was only trying to rationalize two disparate findings:

1) Mark Schneider wrote:
>> light boat with crew will be stopped by large waves...
so you loose your attached flow on your sails and cannot respond quickly enough with the sheet to keep the boat going. A heavier boat with same crew will have more momentum and a greater chance to maintain some speed and keep flow attached. Robbie Daniels who race a Tcat and raced a prototype M20 for some time reported this behavior. He wasn't sure if developments in sailing technique could compensate in those conditions for the loss of mass.

2) Wouter wrote:
>> Why does a 122 kg M20 with 150 kg crew on board suffer from lack of momentum while a 135 kg Prindle 16 with 150 kg crew on board doesn't ? This is considered a lightweight baot the latter a normal weight boat. The momentum difference between both is less than 5 %.

My only point was that if you're going to compare a "light" boat with a "heavy" boat then all other parameters must be comparable except for weight. So it would be fair to compare a heavier F18 to a lighter F18HT if both had same rig and sail dimensions, sail geometries, hull shapes, etc. Not fair to compare a 16' boat with a 20' boat, expecially boats with different rigs etc. That being said, I do think that ANY design has tradeoffs and limitations and it IS the observation of skilled sailors that the M20 has some undesireable characteristics in light wind and chop/waves. No boat is going to excell above all others in all conditions. This doesn't make the M20 inferior (what a GREAT BOAT!). I'd be interested in hearing from others what they think causes this M20 behavior if their opinion differs from my arguments. Also, what other boats experience similar behavior in people's experience? My guess would be F18HT's as one example unless their hulls are really good at piercing the waves.

Jerry